Laptops for all senior school children.

[Leroy]

1.

Speculative. You can't really say that we would be any better or worse off under them; if things were different, then things would be different. Let us not forget that Howard & co. did ride and fuel the bubble of this economic cycle, particularly through housing. Though I agree that the advice sought by the government about the guarantees is questionable.

2.

Australia is already federalist by law. Granted there is economic trouble, but it does not follow that some or all investment in infrastructure or education is irresponsible, or that a smaller government would respond any differently / have greater power to avert the crisis (look how the Americans are going at the moment). People with good technology skills will be essential to the economy in the coming decades (some of the academics I work with at uni have poor computing skills, which limits their productivity, application of their vast knowledge and the reliability of what they DO produce).

Point 1 - No, not speculative. Why do any runs on banks occur? Due to fear of losing your money if you leave it there. 1 million dollars is far more than most people have in deposit in this country - and therefore far more than financial institutions (especially the smaller non banks) should have been expected to pay to guarantee. That's akin to paying insurance premiums for a million dollar house, when your house is only worth 250,000... it doesn't make sense. The end result was that those institutions that would not pay for a guarantee more expensive than they actually needed were forced by government to freeze peoples accounts.

How can you say Howard and Co fueled a bubble? Until the financial crisis starting making headlines in the latter half of '07, there was never even a bubble to begin with - merely sustained economic growth! If US lenders hadn't have been caught out by making loans for assets that ended up worth less than the loans themselves, we would still be experiencing the pre 2007 boom. It is only now that Australian investors and institutions (who can no longer buy/sell their products in the US market) are losing money, and consequently prices have fallen, that people are calling it some form of bubble...

There is no causal relationship between the US and Australian housing markets other than the Australian market is sliding as a result of Australian lenders having their cheap supply of funds cut off.

Point 2 - Allow me to clarify; I refer to federalism as in Rudd's self proclaimed plan for the nation. I completely recognise that no state has the individual power to affect the response to the financial crisis. What I call upon you to recognise, however, is that the states have been able to get by on their own budgets for many years now, and are still able to fund their own systems etc. Other than the odd bit of relief here and there, now is a completely inappropriate time to allocate historically large portions of federal money to the states - especially when its only for the purposes of keeping some flashy election promises (ie laptops).

In short, I'm saying Rudd and Co should weather the storm a bit longer before throwing away the surplus.

Edited December 2, 2008 by Leroy

[mrs.sportivo]

alright motherfkers, dont get your panties in a bunch

[spillige]

alright motherfkers, dont get your panties in a bunch

i free ball so im cool

[DHC09]

alright motherfkers, dont get your panties in a bunch

Com'on now... we all know how much leroy wants to convert TOCAU from a car based forum to a debating one. :P :P :P :P

You of anyone knows how much he loves a fight and let everyone know how much he know... so just enjoy the show :D :D :D

Edited December 3, 2008 by DHC09

[Leroy]

alright motherfkers, dont get your panties in a bunch

Com'on now... we all know how much leroy wants to convert TOCAU from a car based forum to a debating one. :P :P :P :P

You of anyone knows how much he loves a fight and let everyone know how much he know... so just enjoy the show :D :D :D

Lol - ease up dude B) . I just like the odd bit of intelligent debate, rather than the usual million "omg where do i get a supercharger/turboz/CAI/panel filter" threads.

No one wins or loses here... i'd quite like to see the next reply from MR22ZZ and Keisari, actually. (and I thank them for actually putting some thought and effort into their replies)

For that matter, why don't you put your 2 cents in, DHC09... laptops for students - a good move?

EDIT - I'm broadcasting live radio right now. I'm willing to read all your responses if you get them in within the next half hour, lol.

www.canberra.edu.au then scroll to the bottom right to stream your chosen format.

Edited December 3, 2008 by Leroy

[DHC09]

Well it should be about turbos, SC, original mods, and track times. Sure it’s the club lounge but I personally don’t see much point in having such an in-depth/heated discussion which you seem to enjoy. Don’t get me wrong, I have no problem with such discussions but don’t think this is the place or the audience for it. You’re better off and have more satisfaction at a proper political/economics forum cause I think you’re wasting your time here since there are only a handful of people that “can” contribute and even less that would even bother.

You’re not the only one here who can contribute intellectually to the forum; there are many many members here with expert opinions on a variety of issues. For example you don’t see me starting threads discussing the revolutionary advancement in DNA based vaccines or the age long debate on G.o.d VS Science (which my letter was published in TIME :P), but we know this is not the place for it as most of the time it won’t get anywhere productive and end up like a youtube comments section. Majority of people come here to read about car related subjects, if they want an economic fix they read the wall street journal etc.

RE OP: My high school (John Paul College) was the first and only school at the time which required everyone over year 8 to have a laptop. I personally thought it was great, everything was given and submitted electronically and if the student prefers it on paper, he/she just needs to go to the printing hub. The novelty of having easy access to games and music on their laptop does wear off and do get on with their school work. However in public schools which I attended before John Paul, where there are higher numbers of poorer students and students who simply just don’t want to learn will probably cause more bad than good.

Fark that was long…. Hope your happy :P

[mrs.sportivo]

:)

[Simo]

I reckon everyone should just accept the fact that middle class Australia will just kept getting ****** up the sphincter by dead **** (I am an idiot i swear) on the dole, and (I am an idiot i swear) with money and the money should be spent on more useful things like nuclear missiles or sumthing cool like that. we should **** up the french with them too, **** the french :)

[mrs.sportivo]

omg we can say (I am an idiot i swear) :)

[Keisari]

Point 1 - No, not speculative. Why do any runs on banks occur? Due to fear of losing your money if you leave it there. 1 million dollars is far more than most people have in deposit in this country - and therefore far more than financial institutions (especially the smaller non banks) should have been expected to pay to guarantee. That's akin to paying insurance premiums for a million dollar house, when your house is only worth 250,000... it doesn't make sense. The end result was that those institutions that would not pay for a guarantee more expensive than they actually needed were forced by government to freeze peoples accounts.

When I said you were being speculative, I was referring to your assertion that you know for a fact that we would be better off under a liberal government. That certainly is speculative, since it is completely hypothetical. I think I alluded previously to agreeing with what you said about the guarantees and bank runs.

How can you say Howard and Co fueled a bubble? Until the financial crisis starting making headlines in the latter half of '07, there was never even a bubble to begin with - merely sustained economic growth! If US lenders hadn't have been caught out by making loans for assets that ended up worth less than the loans themselves, we would still be experiencing the pre 2007 boom. It is only now that Australian investors and institutions (who can no longer buy/sell their products in the US market) are losing money, and consequently prices have fallen, that people are calling it some form of bubble...

There is no causal relationship between the US and Australian housing markets other than the Australian market is sliding as a result of Australian lenders having their cheap supply of funds cut off.

I am of the camp who believe that there is no such thing as sustained economic growth in the current financial system, only inevitable and predictable cycles of boom and bust. There is always money to be made no matter what point in the cycle we are in, but I do think that the phrase "sustained economic growth" is just politician speak. I suppose it is simply a matter of perspective. But I do hold the previous government somewhat responsible for allowing personal debt to spiral under the guise of "sustained economic growth", yet for all the debt that so many people are now under pressure for, there is remarkably little to show for it (unlike, for example, China). Apparently the solution is to buy lots and lots of stuff over Christmas, something like a patriotic duty. Consumerism fixing the problems of consumerism. And so the cycle begins again...

Point 2 - Allow me to clarify; I refer to federalism as in Rudd's self proclaimed plan for the nation. I completely recognise that no state has the individual power to affect the response to the financial crisis. What I call upon you to recognise, however, is that the states have been able to get by on their own budgets for many years now, and are still able to fund their own systems etc. Other than the odd bit of relief here and there, now is a completely inappropriate time to allocate historically large portions of federal money to the states - especially when its only for the purposes of keeping some flashy election promises (ie laptops).

I agree that right now is possibly not the best time to implement said election promise. I don't really know since I have little idea about the federal books. However, it is completely false to say that the states get by largely on their own budgets. States receive commonwealth funding for hospital services and infrastructure, as well as massive amounts of funding for educational institutions, research initiatives and welfare programs, in addition to the odd handouts you alluded to. Not to mention things like defence and investments in commerce and industry. Further, the amount allocated to the laptops is not 'historically large'. Welfare alone takes up something in the order of 30% of GDP (though don't quote me on that, my accounting teacher in high school told me that a loong time ago, haha).

[Keisari]

alright motherfkers, dont get your panties in a bunch

You of anyone knows how much he loves a fight and let everyone know how much he know... so just enjoy the show :D :D :D

I don't think there's any heat here :P I've debated conservative christians about their 'evidence' for *** or intelligent design. THAT's heat :P

[Keisari]

LOL wtf you can say (I am an idiot i swear) but you can't say g/o/d???

That's hillarious!

Edited December 3, 2008 by Keisari

[Keisari]

EDIT - I'm broadcasting live radio right now. I'm willing to read all your responses if you get them in within the next half hour, lol.

www.canberra.edu.au then scroll to the bottom right to stream your chosen format.

Oh you're broadcasting from a .edu I see. What do you do for a crust, leroy?

[Simo]

IF you say (I am an idiot i swear) too much people whinge, I should edit my above post...

[spillige]

Well it should be about turbos, SC, original mods, and track times. Sure it’s the club lounge but I personally don’t see much point in having such an in-depth/heated discussion which you seem to enjoy. Don’t get me wrong, I have no problem with such discussions but don’t think this is the place or the audience for it. You’re better off and have more satisfaction at a proper political/economics forum cause I think you’re wasting your time here since there are only a handful of people that “can” contribute and even less that would even bother.

You’re not the only one here who can contribute intellectually to the forum; there are many many members here with expert opinions on a variety of issues. For example you don’t see me starting threads discussing the revolutionary advancement in DNA based vaccines or the age long debate on G.o.d VS Science (which my letter was published in TIME :P), but we know this is not the place for it as most of the time it won’t get anywhere productive and end up like a youtube comments section. Majority of people come here to read about car related subjects, if they want an economic fix they read the wall street journal etc.

RE OP: My high school (John Paul College) was the first and only school at the time which required everyone over year 8 to have a laptop. I personally thought it was great, everything was given and submitted electronically and if the student prefers it on paper, he/she just needs to go to the printing hub. The novelty of having easy access to games and music on their laptop does wear off and do get on with their school work. However in public schools which I attended before John Paul, where there are higher numbers of poorer students and students who simply just don’t want to learn will probably cause more bad than good.

Fark that was long…. Hope your happy :P

ignorance is bliss do'h

[Leroy]

You’re not the only one here who can contribute intellectually to the forum; there are many many members here with expert opinions on a variety of issues. For example you don’t see me starting threads discussing the revolutionary advancement in DNA based vaccines or the age long debate on G.o.d VS Science (which my letter was published in TIME

Dude, seriously. On that reasoning, people like Pippy and Xoom shouldn't post pages worth of forced induction conversions. Whilst I concede they are car related, theres only a few people here who can understand the science behind it all - leaving the rest of us to look at it and 'umm' and 'ahh' in its glory. Doesn't stop anyone from learning new things though.

The simple fact of the matter is, this is Club Lounge (for members to, I quote, "...chat about anything"). If you don't like the thread... you don't have to post in it.

PS - But thankyou for putting your 2 cents in. :)

I don't think there's any heat here :P I've debated conservative christians about their 'evidence' for *** or intelligent design. THAT's heat :P

That's a topic I get no end of joy from...

Oh you're broadcasting from a .edu I see. What do you do for a crust, leroy?

I'm still a lowly undergrad student at age 23 :( - formerly economics, now human resource management. I'm a member of a couple of music clubs on campus...

I'm doing a coupla units in summer semester and, because the place is pretty much deserted over summer, can use the uni's radio station to play whatever I want in my free time. Incidentally, one of my summer units is Industrial Relations - hence this thread.

[mrs.sportivo]

The simple fact of the matter is, this is Club Lounge (for members to, I quote, "...chat about anything"). If you don't like the thread... you don't have to post in it.

LOL omg, you hypocritical prick

[MT]

Jimmy said something funny yesterday... "Keep my economics pure and let the Arts students fuss about politics"

[Simo]

LAWL, finger painting 2 minute noodle munchin pansies

[Keisari]

I'm still a lowly undergrad student at age 23 :( - formerly economics, now human resource management. I'm a member of a couple of music clubs on campus...

I'm doing a coupla units in summer semester and, because the place is pretty much deserted over summer, can use the uni's radio station to play whatever I want in my free time. Incidentally, one of my summer units is Industrial Relations - hence this thread.

Hehe yes I now understand where your deeper insights are derived from and why you were motivated for this thread!

I just finished a science degree n diploma in arts down here at Monash. I'm trying to get into honours at Melbourne atm, it's caused a lot of headaches so far though. Unfortunately I never set aside the time to go to clubs, even though I signed up for them! I was thinking of heading up to ANU to do a PhD... but one step at a time hey, lol.

It's pretty deserted around here at the moment as well. That means you can get a computer or a table to eat lunch wherever you want, whenever you want it!

[Leroy]

The simple fact of the matter is, this is Club Lounge (for members to, I quote, "...chat about anything"). If you don't like the thread... you don't have to post in it.

LOL omg, you hypocritical prick

I only ever had a problem with your posts because they resembled omgomgkekeklololozzzfukfuk kient kient fuk fuk lolz lolz.... not because of what they were about. I leave your threads alone now - so please do the same, otherwise (to use language you understand) GTFO no haters keke. <_<

Jimmy said something funny yesterday... "Keep my economics pure and let the Arts students fuss about politics

Funny that - the first bit of university graffiti I ever saw was on a toilet roll holder at the Uni of Adelaide. It said: "pull here for arts degree"

Edited December 4, 2008 by Leroy

[mrs.sportivo]

The simple fact of the matter is, this is Club Lounge (for members to, I quote, "...chat about anything"). If you don't like the thread... you don't have to post in it.

LOL omg, you hypocritical prick

I only ever had a problem with your posts because they resembled omgomgkekeklololozzzfukfuk kient kient fuk fuk lolz lolz.... not because of what they were about. I leave your threads alone now - so please do the same, otherwise (to use language you understand) GTFO no haters keke. <_<

LOL you do know that if you look back to all my posts i actually dont use language like that and you know it - i say fuk because we cant say ****, i say kient because we cant say *****, ya betch ? lols still a contradicting fag tho hahas and you know it thats why your here trying to defend yourself :) and wtf is "GTFO" geez looks like you know more acronyms then me haha

and seriously, if i recall you were all betch betch betch about me talking about my personal life on here :) and im only saying ur a hypocrite now because you said "if you dont like the thread u dont have to post in it" which if i recall, was exactly what i said when you came here thinking you were king sh!t

ps. werent you the one who was betching about all the emo posts as well ? add that to the list then aye hypocrite

Edited December 4, 2008 by mrs.sportivo

[qkslvr]

G O D i love these love/hate threads! Makes this place feel like family. screw the cars, lets all hug it out, Betches! lol

[DHC09]

Dude, seriously. On that reasoning, people like Pippy and Xoom shouldn't post pages worth of forced induction conversions. Whilst I concede they are car related, theres only a few people here who can understand the science behind it all - leaving the rest of us to look at it and 'umm' and 'ahh' in its glory. Doesn't stop anyone from learning new things though.

The simple fact of the matter is, this is Club Lounge (for members to, I quote, "...chat about anything"). If you don't like the thread... you don't have to post in it.

PS - But thankyou for putting your 2 cents in. :)

Mate, talking about the science of car performance is definitely appropriate and appreciated on a CAR forum like this one.

Plus I think you totally missed my point. There is absolutely nothing wrong with debating on the topics that you like but how can you get the feedback you want if there only 2 or 3 people contributing on TOCAU?! I understand what you’re trying to do, but the point is your wasting your time here, go to a real debating forum and have proper discussions.

The simple fact of the matter is, this is Club Lounge (for members to, I quote, "...chat about anything"). If you don't like the thread... you don't have to post in it.

LOL omg, you hypocritical prick

you tell him girl~!

Jimmy said something funny yesterday... "Keep my economics pure and let the Arts students fuss about politics"

I just finished a science degree n diploma in arts down here at Monash. I'm trying to get into honours at Melbourne atm, it's caused a lot of headaches so far though. Unfortunately I never set aside the time to go to clubs, even though I signed up for them! I was thinking of heading up to ANU to do a PhD... but one step at a time hey, lol.

For Science, I'd be looking at going to UQ for a PhD. They got HEAPS of labs there with some pretty fancy equipment (depending on what your working on).

Also most UQ labs are loaded, I'm currently in transit to New York for a conference which my supervisor thought I would be interested in. Life of a PhD student is so hard :P

lets all hug it out, Betches! lol

Another entourage fan i see :D Ari FTMFW

[dannywss]

small topic, HUGGEEEE opinions...

hey, i didnt knew everyone is SOOO into the economic and political world..

wat u study is just 'wat u studied'... is it REALLY the reality?? hrm..