Porting Stock headers or Custom ones?

[CHA54]

you could easily get a set of race headers like that made locally for less than $1K.

Craig at Extreme Custom Engineering in Archerfield used to charge ~100 a runner for custom pipes like that. Add a bit more for the flange and merge collector and you're set. The last set he did for a 2zz came out very nice, I'd get him to make the set in mild steel and then get them ceramic coated locally. He's done quite a bit of work on Jimmy's celica now fixing it up.

Yes, they're RWD.

Edited February 5, 2009 by CHA54

[CK1]

you could easily get a set of race headers like that made locally for less than $1K.

Craig at Extreme Custom Engineering in Archerfield used to charge ~100 a runner for custom pipes like that. Add a bit more for the flange and merge collector and you're set. The last set he did for a 2zz came out very nice, I'd get him to make the set in mild steel and then get them ceramic coated locally. He's done quite a bit of work on Jimmy's celica now fixing it up.

I for one am a HUGE fan of craig as well... i was one of several guys who recommended jimmy to go to craig to get the piping done for his turbo setup.... craig has also made a cat-back system for my car as well.....

however, when it comes to headers, the 2zz is a really fussy engine, and its not just a matter of chucking on a header with a bigger set of runners and a bigger primary... almost all the big name aftermarket headers out there (TRD, C-one, Trial) have had hours of R&D invested into them and still end up loosing power somewhere in the powerband... so far, out of all the aftermarket headers out there besides the PPE, power is made either in the low-end and mid-range but top end is lost... or power is lost throughout the whole rev range except for a few HP gain in the top end....

so id rather pay an extra coupe of hundred and be 100% certain about what sort of power gain i will b getting and where in the powerband the power will b made.... there is always a risk/uncertainty when u go custom, well... at least for the 2zzge......

[CK1]

sorry.. i forgot to add.. the PPE headers did cost less than $1k.... it was $950 delivered to Aus.... and that price also included HPC/ceramic coating as well

Edited February 5, 2009 by CK1

[the_random_hero]

you could easily get a set of race headers like that made locally for less than $1K.

Craig at Extreme Custom Engineering in Archerfield used to charge ~100 a runner for custom pipes like that. Add a bit more for the flange and merge collector and you're set. The last set he did for a 2zz came out very nice, I'd get him to make the set in mild steel and then get them ceramic coated locally. He's done quite a bit of work on Jimmy's celica now fixing it up.

Yes, they're RWD.

+1 for Craig too, great guy, absolute genius fabricator. We do a fair bit of stuff for him, and in turn he does a bit of work for us.

I'm in talks with my boss now, trying to see what the prices would be for us to do a set of tuned-length extractors for different later-model Corolla's. At the moment we're too flat out to try anything new, but I can't see why we couldn't make up a set in the next couple of months.

Anybody else want systems, you know who to PM :P

[SILVABULLIT]

It all comes back to the supply and demand principal. There are a lot of people on this forum who say they want custom headers but when it all boils down to it they won't fork out the $$ to buy them hence companies like CES isn't going to spend a lot of hours of R&D and dyno time to produce something that they may only sell 1-2 sets a year. Just not good business principals and not cost effective. Remember you are driving a Sportivo Corolla not a Rex,Evo etc etc.

Sure if you rock up with your car and say develop me a set of headers they'll do it but so far nobody has put the cash up to do it....

Like CK said the 2ZZ is a fussy animal when it comes to exhausts so a lot of time will be spent on trialling different set ups etc etc to finally get something to make the gains where they are needed.

A good fabricator won't give you something that won't work......

[Blind Kid Seeks]

CES isn't going to spend a lot of hours of R&D and dyno time to produce something that they may only sell 1-2 sets a year. Just not good business principals and not cost effective. Remember you are driving a Sportivo Corolla not a Rex,Evo etc etc.

Hang On a Minute......

I thought thats why everyone paid the big bucks for a CES cat Back.. or a CES CAI, now your saying they didnt spend the time R&Ding it??

I'm confused SB.....

[CHA54]

A good fabricator won't give you something that won't work......

That's right, everything I've ever had done by Craig has worked.

[DHC09]

CES isn't going to spend a lot of hours of R&D and dyno time to produce something that they may only sell 1-2 sets a year. Just not good business principals and not cost effective. Remember you are driving a Sportivo Corolla not a Rex,Evo etc etc.

Hang On a Minute......

I thought thats why everyone paid the big bucks for a CES cat Back.. or a CES CAI, now your saying they didnt spend the time R&Ding it??

I'm confused SB.....

I think SB is talking about custom headers. There were R&D time spent on the catback and cai. If you dig back to the early ces cai threads you'll find out that there were a few versions.

[doriae86]

just ordered some ces headers aswell

[Blind Kid Seeks]

its 550 for set of headers, right? .... thats expesnive for soemthing that costs $200 elsewhere.

ive barked up this tree before...

anyways...

PPE is an epic set of headers. wish i could justify the expense.

[doriae86]

its 550 for set of headers, right? .... thats expesnive for soemthing that costs $200 elsewhere.

ive barked up this tree before...

anyways...

PPE is an epic set of headers. wish i could justify the expense.

$550- 200 buck deposit = 350 delviered to perth

Excuse my ignorance but I just couldent see another way of getting a set of headers here to perth with zero downtime for less.

[Northy]

its 550 for set of headers, right? .... thats expesnive for soemthing that costs $200 elsewhere.

ive barked up this tree before...

anyways...

PPE is an epic set of headers. wish i could justify the expense.

**** ME, go and crawl back under your rock you stupid toad.....

[Blind Kid Seeks]

its 550 for set of headers, right? .... thats expesnive for soemthing that costs $200 elsewhere.

ive barked up this tree before...

anyways...

PPE is an epic set of headers. wish i could justify the expense.

**** ME, go and crawl back under your rock you stupid toad.....

is that all you got Northy, Nice moderating skills once again.. how is my comment Stupid? and why call me a toad? Is there something specific i said that you dont agree with?.... "you stupid toad" lol

[the_random_hero]

its 550 for set of headers, right? .... thats expesnive for soemthing that costs $200 elsewhere.

ive barked up this tree before...

anyways...

PPE is an epic set of headers. wish i could justify the expense.

**** ME, go and crawl back under your rock you stupid toad.....

I'd expect better from moderators on this forum, let alone "management".

[Northy]

Yeh well im sick of all these wannabe forum trolls, all they do is make sarcastic comments about things that they know nothing about.

[Blind Kid Seeks]

Yeh well im sick of all these wannabe forum trolls, all they do is make sarcastic comments about things that they know nothing about.

I hate to rain on your parade Northy, but if you actually took the time to read this thread.. you'll see i recommended to the OP to contact CES for a set of headers, or for advice.

it wasnt untill SB made the comment on a Varex Muffler that i have, that this thread turned to *****.

So before you start throwing around accusations of being uninformed or uneducated, you should take a look at your own chefs who are poisoning the food.

I know enough about how much, and how effective a piece of pipe is. 2.5" Mandrel Bent Stainless Steel, is the same wherever you buy it. Yes CES make their own mufflers and they are bloody good, and thats what you pay all the extra for.

and as a side note, i'm not here to bad mouth any person, or any product, not at all. Like its been said 1000's of times, CES works! theres no doubting it. And i can see why people buy their products, they look great! its an off the shelf product that everyone can be happy with. but everytime i mention that you can get something that does the same thing as a CES product for less than half the price, i get called names, or bad mouthed, or get shut down. Why? Am i stupid to try and save people some money, or give people an opportunity to make their own investigations, or make relationships with their own mechanics or exhaust specialists. I dont know why i care so much, maybe i shouldnt, maybe i will stop contributing to the community, not that you care.

Just because some moderators say so, doesnt mean its the only thing around that works. My results speak for themselves.

I've had my issues along the way, theres no point saying i got it right first time, but thats what i get a kick out of, when modding cars, the trial and error, and getting it right is satisfying.

And while i understand that CES have spent alot of time developing products for the 2zzge, its not hard for anyone to search around the net and find out whats worked for everyone else with a 2zzge, Thats all i did.

I knew i wanted a Varex Muffler for the flexibility, i bought it, it works. But yet i get ridiculed for buying a muffler who 1 person believes is the solution for somoene who "cant make power without the noise" did it ever occur to this person that i like the noise?? and whats more... when i am tired of the noise, i can just switch it off. Best of both worlds.

so my comments arent sarcastic, they are substantiated.

CES is an expensive product, theres no denying it. My system cost half that, and i have more flexibility. I have it on my car as proof. I am making the same power over stock as yourself Northy, so it works as well.

So In conclusion.... let people make their own mind up. But if they ask for opinions or advice, as a forum member, i am entitled to give my own, opinion or advice, based on My Experience, and My Knowledge. If you dont agree with what i say, then thats fine, prove me wrong, or give your own opinion or advice, but calling me names because i have experienced something that differs from you, isnt appropriate for a public forum, thats childish.

if you have something further to say about this, then feel free to PM me about it.

[the_random_hero]

Yeh well im sick of all these wannabe forum trolls, all they do is make sarcastic comments about things that they know nothing about.

All I see is people who aren't willing to read about something that gets covered once a week, if not more. How do you know it's something we "know nothing about?". I'm in the business, I know what works, what doesn't and what's stupidly overpriced. If I have an opinion on something that gets asked, I'll give it - isn't that the whole point of this forum?

[CME-LFT]

All these damn arguments. I started this post curious about what i should do with my headers and its turned into an all out war over who thinks whats better. At the end of the day people are going to choose whos advice they take.

I got my stock headers done at westside. It was close to home, the staff where professional and helpful, price was decent and im very pleased with the performance outcome. Some people should learn that there are others who choose how to mod their car due to different reasons.

I could tell you over and over again how happy i am with the work that was done but theres always going to be someone out there saying i could do better or gotten it cheaper. At the end of the day, you get what you get and you choose what you choose. The point of this topic is for people to share there opinions and hopefully helps others as it has helped me make my own decisions. Not to fight on whose product is better...its pointless.

I liked it cause it was close to home and if i had any problems i could shoot there after work and settle it instead of importing the product and calling another state or whoever it may be just to get help. Im sure all these other products might be better giving me 2-3kw difference which to ME is not really worth my time. Im not taking it to the track nor am i a professional race car driver.

I could go down to the local burger shop and buy a big ***** burger.....it could be the best one ive ever had but others might like to have a bbloody big mac. WHO CARES?......you all going to fight over it again? just cause i prefur my greazy $5 burger over the $10 mccrappa meal thats guaranteed to always taste the same! At the end of the day they both fill you up.

I think ive talked enough for now

[SILVABULLIT]

Westside would definately be my pick of the custom exhaust shops/ fabricators in Sydney that's for sure.

BKS I have no beef with you at all. Please remember that some of us have been here since almost day dot with regards to a Sportivo corolla and we do grow tired of new people coming here and saying that they have re invented the wheel so to speak and trying mods that were tried and tested to work or not to work quite a few years ago. That's what i get slightly annoyed about as people would save themsleves a lot of grief if they spent a few hours reading and searching this forum about what does and doesn't work.

Not saying you have done this but sometimes the way you word some of your posts people may get the wrong impression of what you are trying to say or do. I have chatted to a few members from all over who sometimes are perceiving your posts in that way.

By all means don't stop contributing to the forum cause forums need proactive members like yourself to keep things ticking along in the modding dept.

Cheers SB

Now back to porting stock headers for some extra torque goodness.....

[Blind Kid Seeks]

Westside would definately be my pick of the custom exhaust shops/ fabricators in Sydney that's for sure.

BKS I have no beef with you at all. Please remember that some of us have been here since almost day dot with regards to a Sportivo corolla and we do grow tired of new people coming here and saying that they have re invented the wheel so to speak and trying mods that were tried and tested to work or not to work quite a few years ago. That's what i get slightly annoyed about as people would save themsleves a lot of grief if they spent a few hours reading and searching this forum about what does and doesn't work.

Not saying you have done this but sometimes the way you word some of your posts people may get the wrong impression of what you are trying to say or do. I have chatted to a few members from all over who sometimes are perceiving your posts in that way.

By all means don't stop contributing to the forum cause forums need proactive members like yourself to keep things ticking along in the modding dept.

Cheers SB

Now back to porting stock headers for some extra torque goodness.....

Thanks SB.

no-ones re inventing anything... its essentially, the same as these tried and tested products... its just coming from somewhere that wont charge an arm or a leg for it. I'm not here to start a "which system is better" argument.

Just because you have been here since day dot... doesnt mean that the new generation cant contibute as well. Otherwise you should just stop letting people register as members. I suggest you either do that, or put up wth the fact the some newer members have valuable contributions that may differ from your experience/expense.

granted, if people searched the forums... then they'd find out... about CES headers, and CES catbacks, and CES intakes. But people will still ask questions, and still want answers. All i ask is that you be diplomatic in your replies. CES are really good at what they do! and they build quality product i'm sure! My friends have it on their cars, i see dyno sheets, and i watch people buy it on here all the time with high reccomendations. But if you want to actively promote their product... do it in a PM, or suggest they do some research on what other users have on their cars, or if you feel compelled to drop CES's name... do it in a sentence with the other options available.

i too grow tired of people coming on here and ask the same question as the last guy... but hey... this kind of behaviour happens on EVERY forum, and i know i am responsible for behaving that way when i first joined here. Its unavoidable, so either deal with it... or you need to reasses why it is that you're coming back on everyday.

On a personal Note.... seeing as though you are now getting personal with me, Can i suggest you take a look at your posts, (all 4500 odd) and tell me that none of yours could have been taken the wrong way, or perceived to be offensive? If you truly can, then i Apologise. But if you're as human as i am, then i accept your apology in advance, and i'll do my best to construct more meaningful posts, with better use of perfect grammar and supply quotes or examples for reference, so there can be no incorrect assumptions made. Now if you could do the same, along with every other forum member then we'll all be happy.

But again, if you're human, like the rest of us.... we'll make a mistake from time to time, or get emotional about a subject, or get carried away with somones uneducated answer on a topic that we clearly know everything about.

And like i said in my previous post, if anyone has anything further they want to take up with me in anything i have said... please do it in a PM. This forum is covered in emotional bullcrap which could have been avoided in a few PM's.

[-JC-]

My Cat's breath smells like cat food.

[KaZe-]

aahhaha damn i love these forums because of this

northy got told? :P

[jaderd]

LOOOOUUUUDDD NOOOOIIISSSEEEESSSS!!!

[and1]

LOOOOUUUUDDD NOOOOIIISSSEEEESSSS!!!

Gold

I like lamp

My extractors are going in on thursday so I will find out really soon. Can't wait B)

[SILVABULLIT]

BKS there have been plenty of my posts taken out of context not because of bad grammar or punctuation cause that is one thing I really hate LOL. Like I said some have mentioned to me in the past about your posts on topics but I personally haven't noticed it till it was bought to my attention.

As for CES products couldn't agree more as that is what I have used as well as TRD on my car when I owned it. So my recomendations truthfully can only be about those brands or where i see first hand info on other brands cause we all know stories get made bigger/ longer than they really are!!

I love new members enthusiasm for their new car or for finding us on the net. But seriously is it really that hard to read the pinned topics at the top of the page before creating another thread about CAI's etc etc. I love it when people think and find an old thread regarding their topic of choice and ask a question in it.

Now back to some good ol' header action..............