Brake Options - Standard Aurion

[Steven]

My Aurion is going to need new front brake pads shortly, but my drivers side front rotor is also badly grooved so I'm considering a completely new front end package (rotors and pads, not calipers).

I found this on ebay, and thought it might suit well

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/TOYOTA-CAMRY-AURION-2006-296mm-FRT-SLOTTED-BRAKE-COMBO-/110660138316?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19c3dbb54c

It's very cheap for slotted discs AND pads. Discs are claimed to be RDA however I didn't think you could get RDA this cheap? I am on a budget here so DBA 2000 series with hi-end brake pads aren't an option, I'm simply after something that's slightly better than stock.

Opinions?

[SCOOTA44]

My Aurion is going to need new front brake pads shortly, but my drivers side front rotor is also badly grooved so I'm considering a completely new front end package (rotors and pads, not calipers).

I found this on ebay, and thought it might suit well

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/TOYOTA-CAMRY-AURION-2006-296mm-FRT-SLOTTED-BRAKE-COMBO-/110660138316?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19c3dbb54c

It's very cheap for slotted discs AND pads. Discs are claimed to be RDA however I didn't think you could get RDA this cheap? I am on a budget here so DBA 2000 series with hi-end brake pads aren't an option, I'm simply after something that's slightly better than stock.

Opinions?

that does seem awfull cheap for those, I would run genuine pads though, i tried aftermarket pads with dissapointing results.

[Adamsy]

Yeah that does seem awfully cheap but i guess it its eBay after all so it’s not unheard of but buyers beware is guess is always the key here to eBay shopping. if it's the real deal then that’s excellence value for money, as for pads i'd really recommend sticking to pads that are tried and tested, so the HPX, REMSA, HAWK, EBC, Ferodo and of course genuine. But by all means if you’re keen to guinea pig a new set :)

[Steven]

Those pads appear on the RDA website as one of their products, and the more I look into it I'd say that buy it now price is around $60 cheaper than what you'd normally expect to pay. Cheap yes, completely out of the question (knowing ebay) then no.

I always hear conflicting stories about the quality of RDA rotors, but the general consensus is that the are perfectly fine for street use. I reckon I have a month left in my current set up before I need to make this decision. Further as I could only find a thread regarding brake options for the TRD I think this thread would be optimal to post other people's ideas and knowledge regarding the standard Aurion setup.

[Buff Hamster]

I recon all rotors would not fail under normal daily driving. If you track or drive extremely fast then yes there's a chance the rotor my crack.

$435 pick up for both front and back kits is cheap imo. Might go and get it later.

[DJKOR]

I was always under the impression that RDA rotors were rather cost efficient (not to say bad, but good value), so considering how cheap things can be found on eBay, the price of that set doesn't surprise me.

I have heard good things about RDA as well, so I wouldn't be concerned about quality. I personally prefer DBA, but that's because of that "Kangaroo Paw" vents.

I recon all rotors would not fail under normal daily driving. If you track or drive extremely fast then yes there's a chance the rotor my crack.

Here in Brisbane with the easy access to Nebo etc, having good rotors is an advantage. I wouldn't be so concerned about cracking with normal or slotted rotors... only cross-drilled ones you need to worry about, but the circumstances vary.

[MartysAurion]

Thats the norm mate. RDA and DBA are made in China now. Same quality but loads cheaper! I even think they export the steel to China and it's still cheaper than paying Aussies to do the labor :P

[Buff Hamster]

I recon all rotors would not fail under normal daily driving. If you track or drive extremely fast then yes there's a chance the rotor my crack.

Here in Brisbane with the easy access to Nebo etc, having good rotors is an advantage. I wouldn't be so concerned about cracking with normal or slotted rotors... only cross-drilled ones you need to worry about, but the circumstances vary.

In Melbourne there is a camera around every corner so you can never go high speed . Unless you know where to go

Edited April 17, 2011 by A Buff Hamster

[Steven]

I'm putting together a little something special, but due to the cost and planning involved it may take a week or 2 to get it together however I'm hoping to get something up by this weekend as long as work doesn't interfere too much

[Adamsy]

do we smell a bigger brake package coming on lol?

[Steven]

do we smell a bigger brake package coming on lol?

[Foss]

GSL have RDA slotted for $250 a pair (I think), so I don't think its unreasonable to think those eBay ones are the real deal. I'd sooner pay the extra $20 and buy them from GSL, though, because I daresay it'd be a bitch to make a warranty claim through that ebay seller.

[Adamsy]

GSL have RDA slotted for $250 a pair (I think), so I don't think its unreasonable to think those eBay ones are the real deal. I'd sooner pay the extra $20 and buy them from GSL, though, because I daresay it'd be a bitch to make a warranty claim through that ebay seller.

yeah that’s true and would be nice to support Greg and his business as he has looked after many of us here! & whilst your there shopping with GSL you may as well pick yourself up some high quality QFM HPX pads too, OH can’t tell i sell ******* for a living! HAHA

[Steven]

As I'm terrible with keeping secrets and I could use some help from the community, I've decided to let the cat out of the bag.

The plan was to upgrade the standard rotors to some 320mm suckers, and change the calipers to the twin-piston VT/VX commodore type. I found the Lexus RX330/350 rotors are an exact fit for ours just that little bit bigger. Further I purchased a twin-piston caliper for fitment trials and was able to draw up a bracket in a CAD program to be cut from 12mm 350 grade steel.

Everything was working fine except I confused radius and diameter with the rotor in a moment of blah, and I've now discovered this caliper cannot be used without cutting away some of the caliper itself which I won't do as it will weaken things substantially.

So my plan now it to keep the 296mm factory rotors, and seek alternative caliper designs to fit. I have considered the AU falcon calipers but I believe they might have the same design flaw which I'll post in glorious paint format tomorrow.

I have considered R33 4-pots which could fit based on some measurements Ive obtained, but these go for a premium second hand, are rarer, and I need one for measurement/fitment purposes first (that's a lot of investment if they don't fit, as they're around $300 a pair where as the commodore ones are around $40 each).

Anyone else aware of any other types of readily available twin-piston or better calipers around that aren't worth a small fortune?

[Adamsy]

mm that's surprising that one for the commodores or falcons twin piston setups can’t be modded with relative ease to suit Aurion? Anyway what about some old four piston Hilux callipers? just need to be mindful of weight then, hence as to why TRD went to Aluminium callipers, even though there a much larger calliper with twin pistons they weight so much less than the standard PBR63 single piston cast iron calliper.

Im sure something can be thought up though : P larger rotors would yield the best results though as the heat can be better sorted with but slotted standard size rotors with multi piston callipers will certainly make a difference too!

[Steven]

The larger rotors are only an extra 12mm bigger on the radius, i did a mockup out of wood and tge difference isbarely there.

I have considered the hilux brakes, but theyre just as rare as the r33 type, but are found in much worse condition but asking nearly the same money

[Adamsy]

The larger rotors are only an extra 12mm bigger on the radius, i did a mockup out of wood and tge difference isbarely there.

I have considered the hilux brakes, but theyre just as rare as the r33 type, but are found in much worse condition but asking nearly the same money

aww yes this is true but that’s 12mm bigger everywhere lol, when we put the TRD Rotor next to the standard PBR one the difference was quite noticeable granted the TRD rotor is bigger than 320mm though. Also larger rotors tend to be around 32mm thick as well which helps but like i said a standard size rotor especially one with a good vein/vent system like kangaroo paw with multi piston calliper will yield great results especially if you use good fluid and high quality pads, have you considered braided lines? i have some for my car but haven’t fitted them yet, I’ll let you know the difference they make or don’t make (they better make a difference haha)

Trying to think of some more good 4 piston callipers, i guess ones of 4wd's will be the cheapest? Prado, pajero?

[Steven]

Ive looked for different rotor designs however the only direct bolt on one is the one already mentioned.

Djkor mentioned that a 320mm rotor was larger than the trd? How big are they exactly?

[DJKOR]

Djkor mentioned that a 320mm rotor was larger than the trd? How big are they exactly?

LOLOLOLOL. I think I need to get more sleep these days Steven. Or I need to give up on the diet eating/exercising plan. When I PM'ed you, I made a mistake. I knew something looked fishy but it didn't click. The front rotors are the same size as a Corvette C5, and when I looked it up, I got the size of the rear rotors of the C5 which are 304.8mm. The front rotors are actually 325mm.

[Steven]

That explains a fair bit.

I would really like to get a wheel of a TRD and take some more precise measurements to compare the 2 different braking systems sometime. It be interesting to see just how different they are.

I've since found the VT caliper is one of the only ones out there that has any hope of fitting due to the mounting bolts offset from the center of where the pads pressure is applied. Basically a flat adaptor plate would work here as the bolt face of the caliper sits at the exact same offset as the strut mounts, if that makes any sense. All other calipers I've seen sit forward of these mounts akin to how the factory caliper does, which means any adaptor would have to be offset as well which would make it far more complex, or at least relying on welded bits. I'm not keen on doing any welding at this creates a weakness in my opinion.

So with no choice left but to consider ways to make the VT caliper fit, I'm reconsidering grinding them down. I think if I grind down a portion so they fit, but at the same time bolt AND weld my adaptor plates to them allowing some overlap, even though it's welded the overall result should be just as strong if not stronger.

Apologies if none of this makes sense

[Adamsy]

lol rear TRD rotor size is 310mm X 18mm with PBR single piston aluminium calliper running 40.5mm diameter piston with Ferodo VS12/1 Pad Material.

Front are PBR 2 Piston Aluminium calliper with 2x 40.5mm diameter pistons running Ferodo VS12/1 pad Material on 325mm x 32mm rotors V the standard setup of

PBR63 Single piston cast iron calliper with 1x 63.5mm piston running NF107 pad material on 296mm x 28mm rotors.

[Foss]

That explains a fair bit.

I would really like to get a wheel of a TRD and take some more precise measurements to compare the 2 different braking systems sometime. It be interesting to see just how different they are.

I've since found the VT caliper is one of the only ones out there that has any hope of fitting due to the mounting bolts offset from the center of where the pads pressure is applied. Basically a flat adaptor plate would work here as the bolt face of the caliper sits at the exact same offset as the strut mounts, if that makes any sense. All other calipers I've seen sit forward of these mounts akin to how the factory caliper does, which means any adaptor would have to be offset as well which would make it far more complex, or at least relying on welded bits. I'm not keen on doing any welding at this creates a weakness in my opinion.

So with no choice left but to consider ways to make the VT caliper fit, I'm reconsidering grinding them down. I think if I grind down a portion so they fit, but at the same time bolt AND weld my adaptor plates to them allowing some overlap, even though it's welded the overall result should be just as strong if not stronger.

Apologies if none of this makes sense

Re your welding point, how do you come to that conclusion? At work we kinda rely on it to hold entire buildings up.

That said, however, you might run into problems welding cast iron. Cast anything can be a bitch to weld because its made up of so many different materials and theres usually so much sh!t thrown in to aid in the casting process that often the weld won't take at all.

[Guest]

That explains a fair bit.

I would really like to get a wheel of a TRD and take some more precise measurements to compare the 2 different braking systems sometime. It be interesting to see just how different they are.

I've since found the VT caliper is one of the only ones out there that has any hope of fitting due to the mounting bolts offset from the center of where the pads pressure is applied. Basically a flat adaptor plate would work here as the bolt face of the caliper sits at the exact same offset as the strut mounts, if that makes any sense. All other calipers I've seen sit forward of these mounts akin to how the factory caliper does, which means any adaptor would have to be offset as well which would make it far more complex, or at least relying on welded bits. I'm not keen on doing any welding at this creates a weakness in my opinion.

So with no choice left but to consider ways to make the VT caliper fit, I'm reconsidering grinding them down. I think if I grind down a portion so they fit, but at the same time bolt AND weld my adaptor plates to them allowing some overlap, even though it's welded the overall result should be just as strong if not stronger.

Apologies if none of this makes sense

Re your welding point, how do you come to that conclusion? At work we kinda rely on it to hold entire buildings up.

That said, however, you might run into problems welding cast iron. Cast anything can be a bitch to weld because its made up of so many different materials and theres usually so much sh!t thrown in to aid in the casting process that often the weld won't take at all.

I think steve is refering to welding cast alu (or iron)...which as you said is a prick to weld properly.

[Adamsy]

i really didnt think finding another set of rotors and callipers that would fit up to Aurion woudl be this hard lol :-/

[Steven]

yes I was referring to welding cast - The VT calipers actually look like they might weld okay, but it's not something I'd be willing to stake my life (and possibly somebody else) on

On my next few days off I'll be making a replica front rotor/hub out of MDF including the caliper mounts so I can go around to various wrecking yards and test different types of calipers. 2 I'm very interested in so far are the R33 skyline, Hilux and landcruiser calipers.