Nearly sorted, end in sight.

[Manxman]

Bought '85 4 runner with fair 2LT @ 370xxx km to put in place of my dead '99 5L. Should go straight in, with minor wiring probs and performance differences. Will have to sort things like ho/lo boost switches, connectors generally & exhaust pipe. Will transfer aircon cabin cooler element, fan speed resistors etc if possible, and have R134a converted pump spare. Will do for a yr or 2 whilst I pay bills and repair 5L. Will have to work out turbo timer/immob ccts etc. Now I just need the weather and physical ability to do the swapping. Should only take a day to get the new motor sitting in & home if everything is pre-loosened. The rest I can do at leisure. 85 4runner for other parts in Perth, anyone?

[Manxman]

Further, what extra electronics do I have to get or transfer into my LN147 to run the turbo motor and basic aircon, as neither were there initially? I'm hoping all the major wiring is in place for the 3L-T version, & I just need to plug it in. I'm hoping T put in one diesel wiring form, with all the options to all models. The modules, however, and any extra dash lights will be more trouble. Both motors have Superglow, but the delay is longer on the 2L-T, & the gloplugs don't interchange. I should be able to buy the Deutch connectors locally to fix up the older wiring. Hopefully, I can re-mount the Jackmaster on the R fender just aft the battery & o'hanging the edge of the wheel well-but I fear it will foul the turbo.

[Manxman]

OK, there's only the aircon on/off switch and chiller ellement to transfer. The turbo is non-std in the 4 runner, and has no wiring. Might not even have Superglow? suspect motor transplant. Only obvious clue to age is the inlet manifold has a butterfly. The solenoid on the vacuum actuator has an unconnected blue, 2 pin Deutsch connector-which is fairly late model???? Anyone know when???? Cannot tell true age/mileage of motor, nor determine by looking which model it is. Can't read eng number-no reach it.

[Manxman]

eng num 2L 20323x cannot read x-too dirty. Toyota say they can't tell me which market it was sold into or when the motor was made. Cannot ascertain if turbo oem or not. Licensing will not confirm nor deny any information on motor history for it nor my chassis-because I'm NOT the registered owner, and since I'm wrecking it, I never will be. All I want is some indicators as to when fitted and whether turbo OEM fitting, but them that can won't tell me, and them that should can't. Gross frustration. Willfull incompetence IMO. If grey import or 1/2 cut motor, can I find out when etc?

[Manxman]

Motor abt 1989. Is 10,000 engines less than motor from 1990. Turbo is prob a kit, but has been well fitted, with a good oil drain to the sump. Looks v professional. Motor has prob done 250,000km. Was prob fitted 5 yrs ago, when orig motor was at 250,000. Wonder what typ maintenance is due? Eng bay has lots of rough tags to injure my hands. Have wiring diagram to retrofit the external voltage regulator. 2 nuts and 2 bolts left to get, then motors out. Slow job, but my health has been poor, and I'll lose mobility again in 2 mths, for abt 3 mths due to other knee replacement. Have to find gloplug timer-I need to swap it over if possible.

[CONROD]

Good to hear your getting there mate,take care of yourself and its a shame your on the other side of OZ as I,d be more than happy to help you out with a lending hand,

take care of yourself mate

[Manxman]

Well, that's both motors out at last. The 2L is not a factory turbo, AFAIK, although it does look very professional, apart from the alt/aircon bracket-which just looks so crude and awful. Looks like spigot brgs are the same size, and the clutch plates will swap. I would appreciate knowing what a variable mass flywheel looks like, so I can tell what I have. Apparently the clutch brgs are different. I discovered that the gloplug timers don't interchange. I will make up a PIC timer multiplier to heat the glowplugs 3.5 times longer than the pulse from the existing timer. That should fix it. I have the charge cct mods recorded for the external regulator. For some reason there were 2 glowplug relays in the 4 runner, either side of the engine bay. LHS was a "new" one. Front motor housing may need replacement, with all other Al cooling parts. Any used abt worth having? Anyone want an L60 rolling chassis?

[Manxman]

Re-my 2L:

the water inlet pipe is bad, I can replace the front housing on the motor.

Q

do I need to drop the sump to do that. IE is the oil pickup bolted to the housing, or is it push in with an O ring and flange? It is the later motor, so a new housing could go onto the 5L eventually.

[Manxman]

new rear seal fitted, new 236mm dia 5L type clutch kit fitted-[replaced flywheel?] flywheel bolts torqued to 60ftlbs. Waiting on new eng mounts before re-fitting. May still have to change sump, as this one has triangular[?] well at front of motor. Still have to remove PS pump (u/s). No jam-pin holes in pulley, must need spanner behind it. Hope I have one big enough-22mm? Next week......Does a 2L-T show that designation in the eng number? Min definitely shows only 2L & I'm still wondering if its factory turbo. It has ALL the turbo parts, except e-sensors/switches. Their holes appear blanked off. I could measure the volume of the combustion space with a liquid through the gloplug on TDC, but I thought that a bit risky with a diesel, as I might not get most of it out again before cranking it over.

[Manxman]

My 5L has the main sump at the rear of the motor, but the 2L has a trapezoidal sump chamber at the front of the motor. It looks a close fit, but I can't tell yet if it's too close. The removable sub frame under the motor is cranked up at each end to get it centrally low, & I have new engine mounts, but I fear that the sump will hit near vertically below the inner side of the chassis engine mounts It only steps in abt 1-2cm each side to the side of the sump from the lowest point of the rubber mount, & it's abt 125mm vertically to the sump floor. I think some scissors and cardboard will show it..

The 2L w'pump inlet has ben bogged up b4 w epoxy, but now the external pipe is well gone. I will sort it.

[Manxman]

Q.

What is an easy way to lower the drag link abt 25mm? That's all it will take to get it in. I'm thinking machined shrink-fitted spacers, I don't know if the mounting pins will come out for replacement-the parts diagram doesn't show enough detail to see how it's made. the steering stops might need checking, if they hit the drag link?

The link is forged, so I guess the pins are pressed in. They don't appear to be ball joints. but they could be. I guess if they are they can be split open by drilling the keeper ring into smaller pieces and have longer shafts fitted.

Edited March 7, 2013 by Manxman

[Manxman]

Update:

Used 3L rear well sump & pickup bought from Melb. Might have probs with dipstick. 'New' sump is plain pressed shape, whereas old sump on 5L and an 89 LN85R was more complex, with multiple sections joined together Seems similar capacity, hope it fits in the ute. Found a universal glowplug timer with superglow capacity in Sydney. Have organized an ali inset for the water pump to replace the corroded outer flange. Apparently there's an expensive brass tap-in fitting for that from Coventrys' in Melb., but no-one here has heard of it, and this is much cheaper for my short term use. I can use 3 bond to seal/hold it in, with a few grub/lock-screws. There's only abt 40 lbs pushing it out. I can use the rest of the tube on the sump joint. It's going to be tough trying to undo the sump with the motor suspended, & then cut it off. It'd better not fall!!!! I don't have a motor stand, which would make it easy & safe. I don't want to work at ground level, as I'm too fat/stiff to bend and be comfortable. I'm working over grassed sand, so you can see my hesitation. I can't easily take the motor elsewhere to change it, nor the car to a better workplace, nor pay to have it done. I can't afford the losses of selling up as is and starting AGAIN. It's frustrating that I have to do all this at a time when my body cannot co-operate and do the necessary work in a timely manner, and my disposable income is so small to fund it all. I'll spend an hour or 2 tonight cleaning the sump and pickup, & hopefully tomorrow I can get something good done. I'll have to drain the motor too, before I start. Hopefully, the 2L-IIT will be installed by thursday, and bolted up, if nothing else. I'll be happy if I get that far.

[Manxman]

Need to make a hammerable tool to cut the sump off. Thought I could use stanley trimmer, but too frail and won't push in. Inverted L shaped, sharpened short arm, with hammerable shaft and a handle. Pref with enough leading guide to stop twisting. O'wise all went well. Will prob have to remove flywheel, but hopefully not front pulley. Very little oil in motor-perhaps 1.5L. Worrying, because I don't remember draining it and it's been running briefly a few times since bought. The light went out and the dipstick was showing some oil. Dodgy rubber seal on sump plug, damaged nut-hard to undo. All sump bolts and nuts undone. A cheap, solid stainless steel domestic knife might do much of it. I'll see what I have. Can heat to bend it, but perhaps not necessary. Engine mounts, alt/ps and belhousing brackets may have to come off. I'll try to progress it further tomorrow.

[Manxman]

Previous sump joint repair was closed up without new silastic-explains the oil leaks and messy motor. Just have to hope it's still servicable. I really get fed up with ignorant tight-****s who won't maintain their vehicles properly! I get tired of fixing their problems before I can sort what's really wrong. +ve c/case pressure didn't help. Clutch isn't mounted, so motor install will have to wait til weekend or next week.

[Manxman]

4 hrs wasted frustration because sump is wrong type. It isn't flat along the bottom until the well, there's a shallow mid-way well too, which is perfectly positioned to foul on the drag link and prevent the motor being fitted. I will have to double swap the sumps between the 2 motors, which I did NOT want to do, but now I have no choice. I am now going to take a week to recover the reasonable use of my knees before I can do any more. NOT HAPPY JAN. Very tired and sore, very upset the people who should know better selling wrong parts, and don't get me started on Australian Tradesmen--there's VERY few of them I'll ever trust to what they're told, let alone do it well. My history with them is routinely abysmal, and it's not me-they're just incompetent, AND they want top dollar for it! Do you wonder why I'm so dedicated to DIY? It's the ONLY way to get a decent job done. In a few years, I'll be too old and weak to keep doing this stuff-I'll have to pay the thieves to do it for me, and pray they do it as well or better than me, but given the past, that's MOST unlikely. I don't tolerate vehicles as made, I'm always making improvents to servicability, function and reliability. If a simple mod can make a task easier or quicker, then I will make it, rather than put up with the makers ideas, which often exist solely to milk the owners pocket.

[Manxman]

Well, progress made. I managed to undo the 2L sump and remove it, then reattach it with just 2 bolts. I then removed the fixed mass flywheel from the 5L, noting that the clutch spring had lost much tension, despite the disc still having a lot of meat. I then undid most of the sump bolts and nuts, until my cheap tools failed by strechings of the deep socket face and both my 3/8" ratchet handles destroying their plastic control knobs. Never buy/inherit such rubbish again! It won't be easy for me to move the engine lifter to the tray to lift the 5L up from it and remove/substitute the sump, but if I get a few bodies it will be easier. I just hope it stays reasonably dry a bit longer, until the motor is in.

WARNING: Some smart bunny redesigned the exhaust header joint so that the flange is rotated 30 degrees between the 2L2T with aftermarket turbo and the 5L. I'm hoping that a) the flange can be knocked free to rotate, or b) I can remove the header pipe and cut a vertical section at 90 deg , and fit a sleeve to allow me to rotate the flange horizontally, to avoid finding/buying a new header. The sleeve can be welded to one side, and the other sealed with a clamp and Silastic.

[Manxman]

More progress: The sumps are swapped, with their pickups. Rain rapidly fills sumps unless sealed. >45mm yesterday, more today and for the next few days. Flywheel still to be fitted and have oil washed off it, then fit the clutch, pump a tire to be able to roll the car, and the motor can go in Sat, if it's not too wet. Slowly, slowly catchee monkey......

[Manxman]

After yet another 6hrs, the motor is IN. Problems with tools missing from site, disorganised and dirty bolts, extra odd jobs having to be done. G'box is coupled, motor mounts appear to be a bit thin, also don't sit down against stops with the holes lined up & don't reach across gap enough into the chassis brackets. What a nightmare of a job. No wonder mechs want $1600 to put a motor in. Awful access to too many bolts, very hard to get good ratchet or spanner arcs. Too much crap in the way. Power steering is unnecessary, it just needed a lower ratio steering box-that would have been cheaper and more reliable for the owner, but the market likes its luxuries, even when they are of little real advantage. My LN85R didn't have power steering, the ratio was wrong and it was just too heavy to move at low speed. Had the gearing been lower, it would have been acceptable. Nothing wrong with bigger steering wheels and 6 turns lock to lock. Now to do the electrics and plumbing........I have til early-mid June to get it done, but I doubt I'll have the budget for all the bits by then. I'm trying not to replace the w'pump/cam belt and rollers at this time. I suspect some parts are missing too. PS pulley etc. Yes, I did pirate the PS bracket from the 5L, so its pump could be refitted. The PS pump from the 2L was u/s, & I didn't want to muck around with plumbing and oil leaks. The new 5L clutch releases. We'll get there....

[Manxman]

HELP Pls?

I'm trying to connect the 2L alternator, which has external regulation. I pirated the regulator, wiring loom and connectors from the 4 runner. I notice that 4 of the same wires are on the 5L electrics, with a different connector. Does that mean I can just join them across one to the other? The manuals I have say the 5L alternator is only internally regulated. I would have thought an internally regulated alternator would have only 3 wires (+ve, field and light], but both appear to have at least 5 [2field, light, white/x and fusebox]. The 2 field wires need to be regulated, so perhaps I need to look at the wiring more closely.
I have installed the external regulator behind the fusebox, and hope to sort out it's connections.

On terminal B is there a v heavy wire to the fusebox [ring teminal] and a heavy white/x wire with a F spade terminal? If not, where does this white/x wire go? I need the alternator to work, as I don't think I can swap them, unless I also swap the RH motor mount brackets, and prob the oil cooler unit-which I might not want to do now the motor is in. PS The alternator is captive in the mount, so I can't pull it out to look at it and see clearly. There isn't room to easily free it from the moved spacers.

[Steven]

mate you've gotten very technical there, but given your (obvious) ability to sort this kinda stuff out I reckon you'd be able to figure out a solution.

Been watching this thread with great interest, be sure to upload some pics though sometime!

[Manxman]

TKS. I worked out I need to identify the B, L & Ig wires at the external 1985 regulators' connector and join them up to the same wires in the car. Anyone able to look them up in a manual? The heavy white/x wires on car and regulator do go to terminal B of the alternator, under the nut. I just hope changing everything back won't be so difficult when I've repaired the 5L, in abt a yrs time........

[Manxman]

Laws against using tow-ropes to move vehicles now. PITA, but that's road safety for you. $110- for 5km transport-30 mins?-suppose it's justified, but I certainly don't make petty cash that fast. Perhaps there should just be a tow-rope users' speed limit, say 10k/hr? Should be able to stop in a few M if lead car stops quick. [without hitting it].

I had the old girl towed home from my friends yard during the week, so I can finish it here.

Anyone confirm LN147R header pipe is vertical in engine bay, or is it on angles? It looks awful to disengage and remove without a car hoist. Also, I want to be able to move the drivers seat back a bit further-any ideas/replacements?

My thighs/gut are large, and don't fit well under the steering wheel unless I'm right back, and it's not quite enough-I need another 1" I'm willing to fit other seats, but the seat height cannot go up at all, and I have to have more leg room. Just wearing boots/joggers causes major leg problems. The leg well's too short, [and I don't want a 6 cyl monster]. I'm only 176cm/130kg, normally distributed. Why do I have such trouble, when taller people fit better than me? I know I'm fat-I'm working on it. Patience, please.

Apart from that, I'm getting an 1/2 pallet to sit the 5L on, and some rollers to run it round the yard, where it will go under cover for a while, til I have money to deal with it-abt Jan 2014. Today, I'll be happy to put my tools away into safe storage.

I fell out of bed asleep midweek onto my knees, and did some damage, still getting over the pain. Not good. Makes the walking difficult for abt 2 more weeks.

[Manxman]

Update:

I've found the 3 wires on the car match 3 last "unused" wires in the regulator connector, colour for colour, so I will just join them up. My w'pump is incorrect, as the fan boss doesn't fit into it well-it's a little tight. I'm unwilling to jam it in via the nuts, that can be very hard to dismantle later, among other things. I'll HAVE to swap the temp senders for the superglow, -unless I use a universal timer, as it's got a different connector, as have a few other parts. I haven't found the connector for the starter solenoid yet, it may have fallen out of the loom, and the glowpug cables have vanished. They aren't in the tray? .Fuel lift pump has broken bracket, & may not work. 10 min priming got no resistance, no obvious pumping air from outlet. I may need to suck on inlet pipe to prime the filter so it will work. Darn Tojo for not making them easily repairable, They just never get out of your pocket! I need to remove the last exhaust flange bolt in the turbo-the thread is poor. The other 2 undid themselves. I'll try 2 locked nuts, but I'll have to get underneath it to do the job...... I've transferred my tools, I can nearly rest from the days work. So near, but still so far, and so many $$ to go.

[Manxman]

I've saved some pics, check "My Media" when site maintenance finished.

[Manxman]

Just a very angry note:

Toyota use their own, in-house Deutsch connectors on the 5L motors' electrics, and if you need to replace them you are REQUIRED to buy the whole relevant wiring loom, both sides. For a $5- part??????? They HAVE to think we're insane! Just chop them off and replace with Deutsch universal connectors-which should have been there in the first place. For me, it's difficult to remove and replace the connector on the fuel pump because the wires appear too short and it's mounted too snuggly in a confined space. I'd have to remove the fuel pump, which just ain't gonna happen at this stage. What a pack of swines. The parts clerk excused the practise by saying everyone else does it too. Thieves!!!! Legal corporate theives!!!!

In case you haven't noticed, I get more than a little upset when it's demanded that I pay exorbitant prices for goods and services from the few discretionary dollars I can put into my projects. I cannot get some aluminium welding done for <$50- for what will be 10 minutes work to fabricate a part. I guess I'll have to pay it, as there's no convenient alternative, but you can bet I'll not use him again without protest. These guys seem to just invent a price from thin air, and expect the mug public to pay. That's not fair, and they all do it. It's hard to travel to their workplaces to do business. Phone shopping just leads to them making errors, on the simplest of jobs-I don't trust tradesmen-they're expensive, and they often bugger up the job because they just cannot/willnot do as told in a professional manner. I understand how to do the job, I haven't the tools or skills to DIY, so
I hire them because they're quallified-and they wreck what I'm trying to do. Then they demand top wages for a stuff-up. I'm very upset by the commoness of such events.

Edited June 8, 2013 by Manxman