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It pays to be informed and to be able to critically analyse and assess emerging technological advances. I just came across this very recently released YouTube video. I also had a good laugh about the ending comments about asking 15 year olds what they want. Some needs are timeless.  😁 

 

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Interesting stuff Ash. It's almost like what we saw in Back to The Future II lol. Well, it's getting that way. Hopefully they can invent a time machine too so I can go back in time and steal the Greys Sports Almanac. :laugh:

On a more serious note, I find it pretty fascinating how fast the tech is evolving. Ten years ago we were all kinda laughing about it and now it's getting serious. There will upsides and downsides of course, but I guess the smart engineers and marketing boffins will hopefully make this transition as painless as possible.

I have a couple of concerns too. I, like Sandy there, don't agree with the battery swap thing either. Fiddling constantly with electrical/electronics will have a detrimental long term effect. Good idea in theory though. If they can make a bullet proof connector then this could be a feasible solution for certain people and their needs.

Another thing I disagree with is the "no paint, no chrome" idea and having the plastic impregnated with the colour. How boring is that ??? Come on.
Keeping a car clean, shiny, minty is all part of the pleasure of ownership and if they are going to turn cars into ice cream containers, then I'd say, no thanks.
 

I had a little chuckle about the 15 year old's idea of what a car should be too. It has to be fast, with two doors and no back seat to impress their girlfriend. What ? no back seat ??? :biggrin:

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1 hour ago, Tony Prodigy said:

how fast the tech is evolving. Ten years ago we were all kinda laughing about it and now it's getting serious.

Dreaming is turning into reality. Development is becoming production. Latest issue is to now sort out the required supply chain. Electric cars are now being seen to be taken seriously by the established ICE vehicle manufacturers. Their survival depends upon it; adapt for survival or perish.

Interesting point about the connector and swapping the battery. Perhaps battery swapping is an interim step strategy for that Chinese brand appropriate for their market.

2 hours ago, Tony Prodigy said:

the "no paint, no chrome" idea and having the plastic impregnated with the colour.

Good manufacturing solution to drive down production costs. I am sure that there will be plenty of after market suppliers to step in and customise vehicles.

2 hours ago, Tony Prodigy said:

I had a little chuckle about the 15 year old's idea of what a car should be too. It has to be fast

Have to agree with some of their thinking because I do not want a slow vehicle especially on the highway.

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NO BACK SEATS???? well the poor kids of tomorrow will find a way to enjoy the learning curve of "you know what" without a back seat, but damn they were fun days of my first car a old mini cooper. mind you She Who Must Be Obeyed says she was way more flexible then as was I 😉😉😉

KAA

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Just viewed this recent YouTube video. It confirmed my suspicions/thinking of why and how Tesla was able to establish in China. Handing over 100% of their technical documentation should have given a boost to the local Chine EV Auto Industry. Looks like Tesla was becoming too successful and threatening vested interests in the CCP. Future Rise or Fall of Tesla in China is something else to watch.

 

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I viewed a YouTube video about BYD in which Toyota was mentioned about being a "licensed" user of their electric vehicle platform. 

Now just viewed this following YouTube video. Looks like Toyota is making a lot of strategic survival partnerships foe EV manufacture. For Tesla, it looks like a potential foothold into the Japanese auto market to increase production volume and achieve further economies of scale to reduce production costs. 

 

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Wow. I never imagined this would be. That's actually a master stroke by Tesla, hitching its wagon to Toyota's horses. This would alleviate many of the known complexities and hopefully streamline the entire manufacturing/delivery of the product. They can also learn about quality control too, something they've been lacking for a long time. The Japs are masters at making cars and I would have more confidence in the product knowing it came from one of their plants.

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I came across this video and it really opens your mind to the complexities and the perpetuation of a new kind of pollution. While the climate alarmists sound the siren on C02, they forget how dirty the process of mining and refining lithium is. Why aren't they crying about this too ? The statement being made is "How Green is you Electric Car" ? When they want to base the future on Lithium batteries, watch the video and see what you think.

Me personally, I think Hydrogen would be the way to go as an alternative to fossil fuel because I can see us paying a heavy price for the pollution to come from lithium mining. The almighty dollar will rule, as always, while the rich keep poisoning our planet. Recklessness will have its consequences.

Watch this.

 

 

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After looking at this video, I have a better appreciation of the sustainability of recycling and why it will be so essential in future years for the supply chain. 

 

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Excellent videos Ash. I am a huge fan of recycling. The E-waste coming off of all the battery powered devices should prompt the responsible handling of these valuable resources to be able to take the burden off mining as such. Mining will and have to exist obviously, but we should not be reckless about it either. We've had too much risky behaviour from the Nuclear sector in the past and we really cannot afford to add another one to the mix.

I'm sure they'll come up with improved solutions as we go forward and it will be exciting to see how they will handle the ever growing demand for lithium ion batteries. It's going to be huge, even after we're gone, the future generations will have a huge responsibility on their hands. 

It would be a great opportunity for the Australian Govt to get involved in these recycling programs here too and restart the manufacturing industry they killed off.

We need our independence back as we move into uncertain times..

 

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On 5/4/2021 at 3:57 AM, Tony Prodigy said:

Wow. I never imagined this would be. That's actually a master stroke by Tesla, hitching its wagon to Toyota's horses. This would alleviate many of the known complexities and hopefully streamline the entire manufacturing/delivery of the product. They can also learn about quality control too, something they've been lacking for a long time. The Japs are masters at making cars and I would have more confidence in the product knowing it came from one of their plants.

I have been thinking about the synergy benefits for Tesla and Toyota. Tesla excells with software and adopting new manufacturing processes while Toyota excells in producing a quality reliable product. Following video gives some insights that Tesla is having upon Ford EV. 

 

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Looks like lithium iron phosphate batteries have great potential for use in standard EV with a range of 250-300 miles and to lower the cost for these vehicles. Still a case of potential being turned into reality for a lower priced EV to hasten the adoption rate of EVs. Something else to watch for in the next year or so. 

  

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I have just viewed this YouTube video about BYD planning to bring a new electric car to the Australian market. Range of 600kms is a worthwhile consideration.

It will be interesting to see when this actually happens and the usual stumbling block of price. Expecting that the early adopters will get stung/price gouged.

 

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I've never heard of BYD. But that car looks amazing ! It will be interesting to see how these will fit in our market and how much it will cost.

Zero emissions, of course, but it will still need the coal fired power stations to provide the juice it needs. If we shut down all the coal fired power stations and rely purely on renewables, you may find many of these stuck on a road somewhere unable to charge.  This is the biggest problem facing the electric car industry. We need a stable base load of power and when the sun doesn't shine or the wind doesn't blow, it's no good to anyone. So what is the solution ? Nobody really knows unfortunately. It's all speculation.

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I've never heard of BYD. But that car looks amazing !


They were everywhere when I was in Beijing three years ago, definitely one of the bigger "domestic" Chinese brands rather than a partnership with a global one (VW etc) or a bought-out classic brand (Buick, MG). On a lot of them the badge actually lights up in the dark, which was kinda cool but also looked incredibly cheap.

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk

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Following YouTube video gives a good overview of Chinese EV manufacturers and their vehicles available for 2021. I noted that Toyota has a partnership which is a good tactic to overcome any battery supply issues.

 

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Just viewed this YouTube video. Plenty of hype but I readily admit to being a skeptic. Pricing does not seem to be keen enough to tempt the early adopters to jump in and part with their cash. Toyota hybrids are still going to be a viable option.

Good question got asked at work today. Would you buy a 2nd hand electric vehicle? At this moment, I would only consider Tesla because of established battery quality. It does make you wonder what the resale value of these EV will be especially when future upgraded versions are released.

 

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Another recent YouTube video. I reckon that UBER would have been able to negotiate a wholesale price for their fleet size purchase.

Quite interesting to see whether 2022 is going to be a turning point for a significant increase in EV sales in Australia.  I am sure that when the demand is proven, then Toyota will be ready to release their EV onto the Australian market. Until then, they will sell as many hybrids as they can manufacture.

 

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Finally came across this YouTube video which simply and adequately explains the Gigacasting process, benefits and whether OEM can replicate what Tesla is doing. Guess that Toyota will be heavily relying upon their suppliers to achieve the benefits. 

 

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Interesting video Ash. There are many good arguement for the use of the Gig casting process. What an amazing machine and looks really expensive too. I think Tesla are onto something here and with the constant technological advancements it really becomes a no brainer in an ever changing world. But in saying this, there are the Pros and Cons involved.

What strikes me is that Tesla couldn't achieve decent quality control and more to the point, panel gaps, using traditional methods and have to resort to this more extreme option to cure these quality control issues. My Aurion has perfect panel gaps as I'm sure most others here do and it's not even a Lexus or a fancy luxury car and was made using the old fashioned way. 
Nothing wrong with stamped metal in my opinion. Also makes panel repair much easier as you can unstitch and restitch sections of the underbody. But this isn't what manufacturers will care about. They are more interested in driving efficiencies, which isn't a bad thing, but this will make the car a throw away if it's involved in a decent collision, where once upon a time it could be repaired quite easily. A cast alluminium sub frame won't bend like metal and will in most cases just break, rendering it nearly impossible to fix. You'd have to strip the entire car to do a thorough inspection to rule out any further stress cracks in which making a repair unviable straight off the bat.  In the event the car is smashed, I'd say it would most likely be a write off. The upside of this would be that not only could you recycle the good, working parts, but all those exotic materials will have a decent scrap value too. The downside could be that cars will become like washing machines and fridges, no soul and a dash of planned obsolescence. 

 

 

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13 hours ago, Tony Prodigy said:

Interesting video Ash. There are many good arguement for the use of the Gig casting process. What an amazing machine and looks really expensive too. I think Tesla are onto something here and with the constant technological advancements it really becomes a no brainer in an ever changing world. But in saying this, there are the Pros and Cons involved.

What strikes me is that Tesla couldn't achieve decent quality control and more to the point, panel gaps, using traditional methods and have to resort to this more extreme option to cure these quality control issues. My Aurion has perfect panel gaps as I'm sure most others here do and it's not even a Lexus or a fancy luxury car and was made using the old fashioned way. 
Nothing wrong with stamped metal in my opinion. Also makes panel repair much easier as you can unstitch and restitch sections of the underbody. But this isn't what manufacturers will care about. They are more interested in driving efficiencies, which isn't a bad thing, but this will make the car a throw away if it's involved in a decent collision, where once upon a time it could be repaired quite easily. A cast alluminium sub frame won't bend like metal and will in most cases just break, rendering it nearly impossible to fix. You'd have to strip the entire car to do a thorough inspection to rule out any further stress cracks in which making a repair unviable straight off the bat.  In the event the car is smashed, I'd say it would most likely be a write off. The upside of this would be that not only could you recycle the good, working parts, but all those exotic materials will have a decent scrap value too. The downside could be that cars will become like washing machines and fridges, no soul and a dash of planned obsolescence. 

 

 

It would take a lengthy post to rebut the points that you have raised. There are a number of YouTube videos for this purpose. Looks like Tesla will be making their next model with 3 major body parts, front body casting, structural battery pack and the rear body casting. There is also speculation of a future 1 piece body casting but that may some years away, if ever.

I have seen some videos speculating about the future of car maintenance shops as EV will not require as much regular maintenance e.g. engine oil changes etc. Guess that the panel beaters will also have to adapt and learn a few new techniques to repair electric vehicles or even replacing a badly damaged body casting with a new one.  

Until flying cars or anti-gravity sleds become a reality, there will be an ongoing need for tyres.

Another bit of speculation is that existing OEM vehicle manufacturers could continue to manufacture the vehicle body etc but use partners to supply the battery packs, electric motors and software. Toyota could be partnering with BYD and Tesla for this purpose.

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This is another YouTube video from Sandy Munro. A lot of DIY EV enthusiasts would love to be getting access to the scrap bins.

This video helps to explain why Toyota and Hyundai etc have developed a seperate chassis architecture for their electric vehicles. If it was practical to shoehorn in the various EV components into an existing platform, then they could have released their EV models years ago.

Another interesting point was Sandy saying that they are doing commissioned teardowns in secret looking for cost benefits for the manufacturer.

 

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Latest news about BYD and what to expect with 3 models being available in Australia within the next 4-9 months.

Quite possibly, Toyota is using the BYD battery pack in their soon to be released EV SUV model.

Good point was made that legacy auto makers are promising lot but not able to deliver much with priority to the EU market where penalties are higher if they do not meet certain mandated targets.

I can certainly see a future scenario where ICE and hybrid buyers in Australia may no longer join wait lists if there is ready availability of EV alternatives/substitutes.

 

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As reported in this YouTube video, CATL [world no.1 battery supplier] and Tesla have joined forces together. Presenter is expecting that they will be 2 of the largest companies by 2030. This will ensure that Tesla has the necessary battery supply for their future vehicle production.

Purely speculating but this indicates to me that Toyota will have to join forces with multiple battery suppliers to ensure their future survival. Securing your supply chain and reducing production costs will be key factors.

 

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