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11 hours ago, Tony Prodigy said:

Yes, I tend to agree. If the engine has been well maitained it shouldn't be necessary. I'd really only use engine flush where sludge is detected and it needing a more aggressive approach to cleaning it out. Of course, there are different approaches to desludging, but if you want an off the shelf solution, then yes, go for the engine flush such as the Liquimoly. 

 

Engine flush should really be added with the new oil. I think that's what he meant. Makes sense right ?

I don't like to mix brands if I can help it. That's my OCD kicking in lol.. I've only ever used the Nulon fully Synthetic 5W-30 in my Aurion and am very happy with it. I also service my Dad's Aurion and for his car I soley use the Penrite brand just to change it up a bit and compare.


I'm sorry my comment about adding the flush to new engine oil and then draining was meant in a general way. Because most EOF that we can buy just say to add this to the oil before draining (after running for X amount of time).

And whilst I can understand why they say this, but adding this to engine oil that is already at the end of it's life (as well as the oil filter) is the least effective way of doing it.

For me once I find something that works, I usually just stick with  it.

But I do like to "experiment" which is why I decided to try Liquimoly Molygen 10W30 (which is apparently full synthetic)

The 5W30 comes up as incompatible on both Autobarn's list, as well as Liqui Moly Australia for my car.

What led me down that garden path is that I was looking at Liqui Moly additives, and what's available here in Australia,

And decided that instead of adding an additive to my usual oil (Shell Helix ultra 5W30, usually the ECT), I would just buy Liqui Moly oil which is roughly the same price as my usual oil.

I have plenty of my usual oil on hand so if it doesn't work out, I'll just change it :-)


(https://autobarn.com.au/ab/Autobarn-Category/Brands/LiquiMoly/Liqui-Moly-Molygen-New-Generation-10W-30-5L/p/OA04961)
 

Edited by Novicebutnice
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Just to clarify the idea is to add it to the used oil about to be dumped, run it for 15 minutes @ idle, I like to take it for a drive around the block about 15 minutes @ light throttle to wash it well with the extra pressure. Park it then dump the oil, let it drain till nothing comes out then re-fill with new oil. No need for multiple drains & fills.

What I did in the past on my old celica was to flush every main service which was every 10K kms but always changed the oil every 5K kms. On the Aurion I'll do every 7.5K kms (full synthetic) as I know it makes a difference. The celica did 325K kms since new following this procedure and always used the same oil which was Helix 10W30 or HX7. The 2ZZ-GE engine was bombproof & never used a drop of oil. That was my way, yours could be a variation of this, all up to the individual of course.

Edited by ZZT86
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2 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

Just to clarify the idea is to add it to the used oil about to be dumped, run it for 15 minutes @ idle, I like to take it for a drive around the block about 15 minutes @ light throttle to wash it well with the extra pressure. Park it then dump the oil, let it drain till nothing comes out then re-fill with new oil. No need for multiple drains & fills.

What I did in the past on my old celica was to flush every main service which was every 10K kms but always changed the oil every 5K kms. On the Aurion I'll do every 7.5K kms (full synthetic) as I know it makes a difference. The celica did 325K kms since new following this procedure and always used the same oil which was Helix 10W30 or HX7. The 2ZZ-GE engine was bombproof & never used a drop of oil. That was my way, yours could be a variation of this, all up to the individual of course.

The idea behind the multiple oil changes is,

The way oil removes contaminants is by holding them in suspension until the oil gets to the oil filter where most is removed (which is why oil filters have a bypass, so that if they become clogged by contaminants the engine can still have a supply of oil, since dirty oil is better than no oil).

As the oil gets "older" it's ability to hold the contaminants in suspension is reduced, meaning it will more so move the contaminants from one area to another (and possibly cause an issue), instead of taking the contaminants to the oil filter (which may already be clogged).

By using fresh oil and filter you are giving the flush the best chance to remove the contaminants.

The second oil and filter change is to remove any residual cleaners, and potentially left over contaminants (like from the sump that you might not have been able to fully drain (I used to refit the sump plug and dump about 1 litre of oil in, and then remove the sump plug, but I've never needed to do a flush).

I agree that everyone has their own version, and some people may not be able to afford the numerous oil and filter changes in my version. 

And I would only suggest doing this if you just bought the car second hand/ have a car with known sludge issues etc

But if someone is servicing their vehicle properly (including doing the in-between services, and using quality oil) than an oil flush isn't even needed :-)

Edited by Novicebutnice
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8 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

Just to clarify the idea is to add it to the used oil about to be dumped,

Oh ok. That makes sense. I recall watching a youtube video where the guy did a whole bunch of servicing to his car, replaced the oil/filter added the new oil and THEN poured in the flush treatment. I assumed the new oil would help further clean the internals until the next oil service. Using the old oil seemed counterintuitive.  Hmm. that's got me thinking again. I might have to go back and see if I can find it.

My apologies for any confusion. Stephen (novicebutnice)

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3 hours ago, Tony Prodigy said:

Oh ok. That makes sense. I recall watching a youtube video where the guy did a whole bunch of servicing to his car, replaced the oil/filter added the new oil and THEN poured in the flush treatment. I assumed the new oil would help further clean the internals until the next oil service. Using the old oil seemed counterintuitive.  Hmm. that's got me thinking again. I might have to go back and see if I can find it.

My apologies for any confusion. Stephen (novicebutnice)

This may help mate, whilst my version doesn't use these products it does show the principles behind it :-)
 

 


But, if you change the oil very regularly and don't have any known existing sludge issues, than adding a flush to the mostly still good oil should be ok (though I would still run a cheap semi-synthetic oil to rinse the engine to get any residual cleaners out):

 

 

Edited by Novicebutnice
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Nice to know that there is another current Forum member trying different engine oils and refining their own engine desludging procedure appropriate for their vehicle. 

Definitely worthwhile to view those YouTube videos about the BG Engine Cleaning products. I had forgotten about having to idle the engine @2500 rpm for 40 minutes for one product. Interesting point about cleaning the screens for the oil control valves. I have previously done this but many oil changes ago. It may be another explanation of why my Aurion is performing a bit better after a recent engine oil and ATF change. 

Knowing what I know now, it would have been worthwhile to spend the $$$ on those BG Engine Cleaners. I had another online search and located this eBay listing: 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/254914126692?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=705-139619-5960-0&mkcid=2&itemid=254914126692&targetid=1281016438476&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9069315&poi=&campaignid=9767741261&mkgroupid=124341098602&rlsatarget=pla-1281016438476&abcId=578876&merchantid=7364522&gclid=Cj0KCQjw4eaJBhDMARIsANhrQADtKU8zHn70EEN1dJzG82dYiigL6E4OJCRz_a9mHCO_tre6rGZNVxQaAvPjEALw_wcB 

$250 AUD is a fair bit of change but worthwhile for those 2GR-FE engines with accumulated oil sludge issues e.g. blowing white smoke on startup. 

I think that I will have to consider at the next oil change planning upon adding 200ml of ATF to the engine oil, going for an hour drive on the highway then very cautiously doing an oil change while the engine oil is very hot. 

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Latest video by The Car Nut demonstrates why the oil change interval needs to be shorter. 5000 miles is equivalent to approx. 8000 kms. Interesting that this is a recent engine with port injection. Issue is further exacerbated by engine idling time so that hours of operation can be a more appropriate mearure than the convenient odometer reading.

Certainly demonstrates the point that oil is cheap compared to expensive engine repairs or replacement. 

  

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3 hours ago, campbeam said:

Latest video by The Car Nut demonstrates why the oil change interval needs to be shorter. 5000 miles is equivalent to approx. 8000 kms. Interesting that this is a recent engine with port injection. Issue is further exacerbated by engine idling time so that hours of operation can be a more appropriate mearure than the convenient odometer reading.

So true. 5000 miles should be the absolute tops when doing many short trips and it should be even shorter for those who spend hours in traffic. One who doesn't deviate from the same driving routine should already know when they need to do their oil. The operative word being "should". Sadly many simply don't and carry on blissfully unaware the potential sludge factory that they are operating will one day come home to roost. Especially those who were gullible enough to take the hook line and sinker deal from the dealer's "fixed price" servicing and stupid log book oil change intervals.

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