vekzla

Thanks for your input.

I dropped the car yesterday and the manager is handling the case now, hes not willing to give me a credit for the fuel filter job which cost me $245 as the car still struggles to start in the morning. Injectors have passed all their tests.

The battery test came back and its just above normal, they changed the battery and started it however they dont want to tell me the result yet.... I am still trying to work a credit for the fuel filter job as that did not help one bit.

According to them, during cold weather the car should take its time starting and its normal for it to act the way it is right now. I am no mechanic but thats a load of BS!, I am so over this car and Toyota mechanics and "toyota techs"..

What happened to the old days where mechanics went out of their way to fix your car. SIGH at fail mechanics....

keepy you posted with the outcome..an other $150 towards this problem.

Ok so here is the update.

Fuel filter job was credit back to me and they replaced the battery which cost &180, the problem seems to be fixed so far. Two days starting it with no problem. only if they picked up the battery fault 6 visits ago

Thanks for your input guys

Thanks for your input.

I dropped the car yesterday and the manager is handling the case now, hes not willing to give me a credit for the fuel filter job which cost me $245 as the car still struggles to start in the morning. Injectors have passed all their tests.

The battery test came back and its just above normal, they changed the battery and started it however they dont want to tell me the result yet.... I am still trying to work a credit for the fuel filter job as that did not help one bit.

According to them, during cold weather the car should take its time starting and its normal for it to act the way it is right now. I am no mechanic but thats a load of BS!, I am so over this car and Toyota mechanics and "toyota techs"..

What happened to the old days where mechanics went out of their way to fix your car. SIGH at fail mechanics....

keepy you posted with the outcome..an other $150 towards this problem.

Are you holding the key on "start" for that entire time? Try just flicking it to "start" and let go of it - the Aurion's ECU should keep trying to start the car for you.

Yes I am holding it on start. So key it over to start and let it go?

The old school ignition is not like our push-button ignition Steve. In the keyed ignition, the starter will only crank when the key is held on start.

vekzla: this is now getting to the point where trying to diagnose this online is going to prove a little difficult. We could keep trying suggestions and you can keep trying them, but this would probably result in a lot of time use up and no solution found. Your best bet would be to find a reputable mechanic to check over the car for you.

As for the battery issue, I have indeed heard cases similar to yours where they said the battery passed all the typical tests, but putting in a new battery fixed it. Go figure. If you can get your hands on another battery to test it, maybe that might be useful.

Thank you for your reply, its great to know that there are people who are willing to help. I will keep you guys posted when a solution is reached.

Thanks!

Are you holding the key on "start" for that entire time? Try just flicking it to "start" and let go of it - the Aurion's ECU should keep trying to start the car for you.

Yes I am holding it on start. So key it over to start and let it go?

I know this has been asked before, but I had something like this happened to my Aurion before and it turn out to be the battery.

They checked my electricals and gave it a pass, I checked it yesterday and it looked good.

Far out, that really is a longer start than usual. Wonder what if can be.

Oh yeah, nice watch too. Show off :P

Yeh its taking its time to start, did it again this morning. Nice watch with the wrong date hahahaha..

Here is the reply I got today from the Toyota tech via email.

" I checked out the footage & it have run it by Toyota techs & they basically said that is ok sometimes the drop in temp will make a start

Slightly longer but in regards to the first problem where it would die… that’s is an issue

If it’s not stalling when starting its ok . that’s what they have said to me

"

Far out, that really is a longer start than usual. Wonder what if can be.

Oh yeah, nice watch too. Show off :P

Yeh its taking its time to start, did it again this morning. Nice watch with the wrong date hahahaha..

Here's something to try. With the engine off, turn the key to ON and apply just a small amount of throttle... like enough to move the pedal about a centimetre. Then try to crank the engine and see how it starts. Let us know if that helps it a bit.

Bad news!I tried this morning and it did not help at all, still took its time before it started.

OK so here is a video of me starting it this morning lol at the wrong date. I have not tried pressing in the petrol pedal technique yet.

Need to turn up your volume bad recording.

IMG_0584.MOV

I was told to stay away from 95 octane as it is bad for the car.

That's a load of rubbish right there. These cars are made to run on 91 RON unleaded with no issues.

Thats what I told him, I filled it up with a full tank of 98 from BP so they cant say I am not following their instructions. Once this issue is fixed I will go back to 95.

The car used to take awhile to start then dies for a bit then starts again, now it takes 6-8 cranks before it starts with no troubles in the middle of the cranking process.

I dont think they will find the problem. I will try and take a video of the car starting up and post it up for you guys to have a look at it.

Here's something to try. With the engine off, turn the key to ON and apply just a small amount of throttle... like enough to move the pedal about a centimetre. Then try to crank the engine and see how it starts. Let us know if that helps it a bit.

I will try that and upload a video at the same time. I am pretty keen to take it to NRMA instead of Toyota Mechanics. I have lost count of how many times I have gone back to them.

So fuel filter changed, fuel tank cleaned and 98 octane used. Car still not starting up correct and it's still at the Toyota mechanics. Told them about fuel Pump they said no, sparkplugs are fine. I don't think they will find the problem lol :(

$245 later they cleaned the fuel tank, replaced the fuel filter and toped it up with 98 octane fuel. Car started for them with no problems. Took it home and the next day it started playing up again. Called them and had it rebooked. I was told to stay away from 95 octane as it is bad for the car.

The car used to take awhile to start then dies for a bit then starts again, now it takes 6-8 cranks before it starts with no troubles in the middle of the cranking process.

I dont think they will find the problem. I will try and take a video of the car starting up and post it up for you guys to have a look at it.

So fuel filter changed, fuel tank cleaned and 98 octane used. Car still not starting up correct and it's still at the Toyota mechanics. Told them about fuel Pump they said no, sparkplugs are fine. I don't think they will find the problem lol :(

First of all sorry to hear about you having to go to the mechanics repeatedly to get the problem fixed. I drive a 08' Aurion and 90% of the time i fill her up with 95 octane Caltex fuel. I dont think there is a problem with the fuel at all. I bet its those mechanics who cannot properly diagnose the problem and doing all guess work wasting your time and probably making it worse for the car. I suggest you get it properly checked by a Toyota dealer. But look around the forum if you could find this issue addressed in the FAQ section. Hopefully some of the members here would be able to give you more help regarding this issue. Have you got the battery fully tested as well? Battery terminals?

Thanks for your reply.

The car is being checked by Toyota dealers. It passed all the electrical tests, he said it might be the petrol station where i filled in the last time. But it has been doing this since I bought the car. It just got worse and worse.

They are going to fill her up with 98 octane and see how that works. I just don't understand how they cannot pin point the fault, the problem these days is they all depend on their computers to tell them where the fault is. The problem with that is sensors can pass their computer diagnoses tests marginally and register a pass but if that sensor is exposed to extreme conditions it could fail, their diagnoses tests don't allow for that.

So Toyota itself is having issues trying to diagnose the problem. I cant figure out what this could be. From the looks of it fuel delivery to the engine is whats going on my mind. Something bad must have got mixed for this to happen. But like you said they have run all their tests so its something out of the box.

Thanks for your reply, i have no idea what it is.. it could be a bad temp sensor that is failing and they are not picking it up or any of the faults given above..i will update you guys once i see them today.

Are there any other problems once you have the car started?

Reason is a few ideas I have below which won't necessary show an error code but could cause starting issues-

Fuel Pressure

A dying fuel pump might take a moment to properly prime the fuel lines to the correct pressure for the car to run. A means to test this is to sit the car on "ignition" for a few moments without trying to start it, as this will prime the lines. It might also cause the car to run lean under high RPM situations which can be dangerous for the car but I suspect the Aurion would detect this and throw a code (and cut the revs).

Faulty Spark Plug

Heavy carbon deposits, incorrect gap or even a cracked plug can cause a variety of issues with cold starting and never throw a code. Under most situations a faulty plug would reveal itself as a slight miss under load, however if the miss is only slight there is every possibility you could easily miss it (although in most cases I'd find it difficult for an experienced mechanic to miss it)

Blocked or partially blocked IAC valve

This valve is essentially what gives the engine air to start and idle when the throttle body is closed, and poor air flow here would make it hard for the engine to get the correct Air/fuel ratio to start. I must admit though with the electronic throttle on the Aurion I'm not 100% whether it even has such a valve, but once started it would mean the ECU could open the throttle slightly in order to keep the idle up. All speculation

Bad Fuel

A favorite of mechanics everywhere to blame the fuel when they can't figure a problem, bad fuel is in reality a very low likelyhood especially given you buy your fuel from a major retailer. Although bad fuel cases exist the controls and testing in place by major retailers to prevent being the liable party for an engine rebuilt or other mechanic repairs is fairly extensive, not to mention the fines they may incur from Government testing agencies should they fail for any reason. In most cases where bad fuel is the problem, the cause is actually crap in your fuel tank which mixes with the fuel regardless of where you fill up. This is more difficult to test, however precise emissions testing can sometimes detected traces of unknown substances being burnt by the engine and it can also result in your plugs fowling up quickly or finding an unknown residue on them. The quickest test though is to install a new fuel filter, as they're relatively cheap and if you do have crap in the tank this should give you a window of time in which such crap cannot get through to the engine and hence you'd find your problem solved.

Hope this helps.

Thank you for your input great help, once the car starts no problems at all. It was very slow and lazy to drive but once they changed the VVTI Sprocket (sludge built up) it drives great. I will quiz the toyota mechanics today.but i dont think its the fuel at all and I had it serviced with them at 45000km and they checked the filters...

what exactly is the problem, ie what are the symptoms.

Car has issues starting when its cold, the car turns over 4-6 times then dies then it cranks over 1-2 times then it fires up.

First of all sorry to hear about you having to go to the mechanics repeatedly to get the problem fixed. I drive a 08' Aurion and 90% of the time i fill her up with 95 octane Caltex fuel. I dont think there is a problem with the fuel at all. I bet its those mechanics who cannot properly diagnose the problem and doing all guess work wasting your time and probably making it worse for the car. I suggest you get it properly checked by a Toyota dealer. But look around the forum if you could find this issue addressed in the FAQ section. Hopefully some of the members here would be able to give you more help regarding this issue. Have you got the battery fully tested as well? Battery terminals?

Thanks for your reply.

The car is being checked by Toyota dealers. It passed all the electrical tests, he said it might be the petrol station where i filled in the last time. But it has been doing this since I bought the car. It just got worse and worse.

They are going to fill her up with 98 octane and see how that works. I just don't understand how they cannot pin point the fault, the problem these days is they all depend on their computers to tell them where the fault is. The problem with that is sensors can pass their computer diagnoses tests marginally and register a pass but if that sensor is exposed to extreme conditions it could fail, their diagnoses tests don't allow for that.

Hey guys,

I drive 07 ATX Aurion and it has massive starting issues, the car has been in and out of the mechanics 6 times now trying to fix this starting issue. It has passed all their tests according to them

When it went to them the first time I got told that it was the fuel pressure regulator (did not get replaced), then fuel pump (did not get replaced) and the last one was the VVTI sprocket (replaced). They could not pin point the fault to 100% so Toyota car care could cover the fault, but I still have issues with starting the car when it's cold.

Now I got a call from the mechanics saying that I am using a bad fuel mixture, could be from the petrol station; I fill up anywhere that says Woolworths Caltex 95octane (discounts) if thats the case then all caltex stations have bad fuel, as i fill anywhere with caltex logo

Has anyone had this issue before?

Cheers,

:(

Not this talk about piston slap again. There are numberous things that make this engine noisy at idle, but piston slap is not the once causing what you hear the most.

maybe toyota mechs need better training, thats what i got told.

Re-booked the car for this Thursday to get it checked out, lets see if they can fix it this time.Will keep you guys informed of the outcome. What a mission

Ok so I rebooked and thank god I got answer back, it was the VVTI Sprocket, it has sludgy oil build up and its not timing properly, don’t quote me here :( I could have misunderstood the mechanic.

Parts are coming from Japan, engine is going to be dropped and is going to be opened for further inspection and get it fixed. Let’s hope this is the issue.

I think you might be refering to a piston slap as i am told it almost sounds like tappets but its just how toyota desgined this engine. I am told 2009 aurion onwords dont have that sound. I have an 07 aurion and it makes the same noise as yous i bet.

Re-booked the car for this Thursday to get it checked out, lets see if they can fix it this time.Will keep you guys informed of the outcome. What a mission

Hi Guys,

I am having a similar problem with my 07 ATX Aurion it has done 45 000km. I took it for its 45 000km service and I told them that it has a problem starting in the morning.

The car wouldnt start right away yesterday morning so I left it with toyota for further inspection. It faulted once with them when they did the service and they said fuel pump or fuel regulator. Now I get a call saying they can't fault it and there is nothing wrong with the fuel system, "come back to us when it faults and we will keep it here for couple of days and run more tests". :(

Battery voltage has passed their tests, I asked them if they have looked at the sparkplugs/starter motor but I was told thats not the issue. If its not the fuel system or the electrical system, then what? Its all a bit confusing, the car has extended warranty but toyota car care wants the mechs to pin point the fault before they can act.

Cheers,

Toyota "recommends" 90000km to change them but seriously they are rated for 150000+km. Just a way of making more money.

Care to point out where exactly you got this information from that they are rated for 150,000km+?

The spark plugs are of the type with an Iridium tip and a Platinum pad (ground), which from what I have read from Denso/NGK/Bosch, are specified to have a typical service life of 100,000km.

Was reading on one of the german websites where their BMW and Mercedes had Iridium spark plugs and some guy took a pic at 150000 and they were still fine.

Maybe Euro cars are different from Jap cars but i don't know.

Hi guys,

I am new here and I just purchased 07 Aurion ATX done 34000km, I had a quick look through the site and found that "piston slap" or tappet sound is normal with these vehicles. The tappet sound is not the only sound that is concerning me.

When the car is started on cold you can hear the tappets (sounds like a truck on idle) and they go quite after awhile but you can still hear them on idle, the other thing is when you first start to drive, a crunching sound is heard just like if your changing up/down a gear in a manual car and forgetting to press the clutch in. Rang Toyota service department and they told me this is normal due to the way the engine is sitting. Piston gap and rings and that’s why there is tappet/piston slap sound.

But I am not sure about this crunch sound; anyone came across this sound before? The car has been serviced by the dealer by the book.

Sorry for the ramble.

Piston slap may not be what you are hearing. Remove the engine cover and listen to the VVT-i soleniod valves (2 per bank), which make a noise similar to what you describe:

As for the 'crunch' you will find this is a normal noise - it is the skid control ECU performing a system check when the vehicle reaches 6-10 km/h on first take-off. You should find about 100 topics on this in this forum ...

Thanks for your reply, I knew it wasn't piston slap or tappets coz it was too fast of a clicking sound

But that's what the mechanic said as for the crunch I wouldnt of known until now.

Once again thanks buddy.

Hi guys,

I am new here and I just purchased 07 Aurion ATX done 34000km, I had a quick look through the site and found that "piston slap" or tappet sound is normal with these vehicles. The tappet sound is not the only sound that is concerning me.

When the car is started on cold you can hear the tappets (sounds like a truck on idle) and they go quite after awhile but you can still hear them on idle, the other thing is when you first start to drive, a crunching sound is heard just like if your changing up/down a gear in a manual car and forgetting to press the clutch in. Rang Toyota service department and they told me this is normal due to the way the engine is sitting. Piston gap and rings and that’s why there is tappet/piston slap sound.

But I am not sure about this crunch sound; anyone came across this sound before? The car has been serviced by the dealer by the book.

Sorry for the ramble.