CH-R sudden engine failure

[GLFord]

Our 2-year old CH-R had a sudden engine failure going up a hill. Afterwards engine started again. It is petrol 2WD. There have been suggestions of wrong or contaminated fuel but we have only ever used 95 or 98 fuel. Dealer says it was a computer glitch. Has anyone else experienced this?

[TIDYWAZZA]

Just to be clear the engine never actually failed it just stopped running at the time then restarted afterwards ?

[GLFord]

Engine lost power and stopped running. Been now told it's due to carbon build up on the plugs and cylinders from fuel despite only using 95 or 98. Has 60,000 km on the clock. Shouldn't do this so could expect recall. 

Edited October 24, 2019 by GLFord

[KOBA_Guy]

Don't imagine a recall is on the cards. There are a number of more likely alternatives. carbon buildup could be symptomatic of a number of situations. Notably a rich fuel mixture. A major cause of this is a clogged air filter or intake. Also excessive stop/start driving in traffic or prolonged idling. Could also be caused by a faulty oxygen sensor or similar. Also, don't assume that "higher" grade fuel such as 95/98 is immune from contamination. Did a Toyota dealer check it out?

Edited February 14, 2020 by KOBA_Guy

[ky2612]

On 10/24/2019 at 1:46 PM, GLFord said:

Engine lost power and stopped running. Been now told it's due to carbon build up on the plugs and cylinders from fuel despite only using 95 or 98. Has 60,000 km on the clock. Shouldn't do this so could expect recall. 

Hi- I have had this exact same issue with my 2019 CHR petrol 2WD. I have had my engine cleaned a total of 5 times in a period of twelve months - basically every 5000kms. There is undoubtedly an issue with the engine design. My car started having the problem at around 63,000km. Toyota have advised now that the car needs a full engine clean as part of his maintenance on an annual basis - pretty sure if buyers were told this they would have asked why and not bought the vehicle.

[ZZT86]

Carbon buildup on valves & pistons is most likely a symptom of the direct injection layout/design. You would lessen the buildup if you did more highway kms, otherwise regular upper engine cleaning is required to maintain it. Really surprised Toyota went with this knowing full well DI is a big issue, hence them moving to D4S in some of their cars.

Moral of the story - NEVER buy a direct injection only motor car unless you plan on regular proper maintenance which includes lots of hwy kms.

Edited April 11 by ZZT86

[ky2612]

I drive my vehicle regularly on highways - travel along the Ring road heading to work 2-3 times a week and depending on traffic sit at between 80-100km per hour.  There is undoubtedly a problem in the design of the CHR motor. My toyota dealership has confirmed they regularly have CHR's in with carbon build up issue.

I have stressed to Toyota over and over again that this is a safety issue- my car simply shuts down in the middle of the road and if I can't get to the side I am at risk of being hit by another car. I have already had one very minor incident with someone just clipping my car.

Toyota have recently pulled the head off my car and completed a full clean and machined the head of my engine- they have also agreed to provide 2yrs of free servicing for my vehicle whilst they 'monitor' the issue. How is this not them admitting fault in the design. This is not satisfactory for me due to the safety concerns and risks this issue provides. I feel sorry for other CHR owners who don't start having this carbon build up issue until after their warranties expire and they are left to pay all associated costs with the repairs for what is clearly a faulty design.

[ZZT86]

I feel your pain, it's a real shame that to all CHR owners. Have you tried the ACCC for a warranty claim based on a major failure even out of warranty ?

The other suggestion is to change the oil far more often, like every 3,750-5,000 kms, especially if the engine gets less than 30min non-stop hwy/fwy driving at 80km/h or more at least once a week and/or does lots of short driving stints which causes the oil to quickly become diluted/dirty. These nasty oil vapours eventually finds its way to the air intake runners, tops of valves & piston rings caking everything up essentially ruining it's smooth operation - a bit like having cholesterol in your vains.

This clip explains it well . . . . https://autoexpert.com.au/posts/can-additives-clean-my-direct-injection-engine?rq=direct injection

 

[ky2612]

Just to give an update and provide information to all those CHR owners who are experiencing issues with the Carbon build up issue that the CHR cars have- after a long and lengthy battle with Toyota I finally won on warranty terms and received a full refund for my car.  Fortunately, I have a BP card which I use for all my fuel purchases so I was able to provide evidence of only using good quality fuels and all my servicing records were up to date. 

As per the advice I received from consumer affairs this is a design fault. Carbon buildup in a motor in such short period of time is not a normal or expected condition for a car and therefore is deemed to be a design fault.   Under warranty laws unless the provider of the product can provide a long term fix- at NO COST to the consumer, then the consumer is entitled to either a replacement product or a refund. As consumer affairs explained to me- if you bought a TV and due to a wiring issue it shut down on occasion then you would be entitled to a replacement or a refund- no different just because the dollar value of the item shutting down is higher than a TV dollar value. 

In addition to this is the fact that the carbon build up causes the car to shut down which is deemed to be a safety issue and this should be a safety recall. Toyota did a recall for faulty towbars for safety- but they don't see an issue that causes a car to shut down mid traffic as a safety issue.....??

At present Toyota's fix to the problem is to issue an internal bulletin to all Toyota dealerships servicing departments stating that all CHR's need to have a full engine clean conducted  as part of the car's servicing. Carbon build up in a car is NOT NORMAL and should not fall under general servicing. This is a fault and a problem with the motor design. The cost of this additional engine clean will be at the car owners expense and as per warranty laws this is not satisfactory. Also if any other CHR owners are travelling high kms such as myself, a clean at the time of servicing  may not be satisfactory timeframe for removing the carbon build up. At the 80,000km + mark my car was requiring an engine clean before i had travelled 10,000kms to remove the carbon build up. 

Toyota provided me with the attached Guest Information notice - this is a joke. My car was not simply mis-firing it was stalling and shutting down. The carbon build up is also not temporary - it is continual due to the engine design. And apparently a CHR needs to be warmed up like an old car and not accelerated hard ? What are they selling an old FJ Holden !( No offense to the old FJ Holden intended here) 

All CHR owners should be made aware of this.

GUEST INFORMATION NOTICE.pdf

[AA1239]

Hi, I am having the exact same issue with CHR!!!!!! How did you go about the warranty refund? Did you go through a dealership to facilitate this or straight to Toyota, would love your input as I have to drive up an expressway home with a large hill and it is constantly happening and I’m sick of this car!!!!

[NikMac]

Driving home on the M1 today between Newcastle and Sydney . I was doing 110 in the right hand overtaking lane when my 2020 CHR AWD petrol model stalled and went into limp Mode. A heap of lights lit up on the dash . I had my 12yr old daughter with me and truck beside me and a 4wd behind me. I thought we were going to Die!! 
My car is up to date with servicing, always use premium fuel and has 73000 km on the clock. NRMA cleared the lights and I phoned my local dealer who wanted me to wait a week to have someone look at it . I was rather pyrauasive and someone is looking at it tomorrow. I hope they don’t try and pull a swifty on me because I am Female !! 

[ZZT86]

It's unusual that Toyota make a dud car/engine but it looks like the CHR is just such example.

Tell them you want a refund & get something else ! If the dealer fobs you off, call Toyota Customer Assistance Centre. If they say no then call the ACCC.

Edited July 24 by ZZT86

[NikMac]

Is there anyone on this thread who is still experiencing problems as described earlier who is interested in joining together with three others including myself who have experienced significant engine failure and placed in very dangerous situation. 
to the person who is getting a refund from Toyota Ky2612 would you consider replying to this message so we can contact you privately to get some advice tips on how you convinced Toyota to give you a refund ? 

[ZZT86]

@ky2612   ^^^^

[PJN]

@NikMac, experienced the exact same issues you described for the second time last week.

Warranty repair after a battle with Toyota. They replaced coils. Same thing happened last week, dealership did an engine clean. The only advise they could give me was to warm the car for 10mins before driving in the mornings.

Just got off the phone with Toyota (no) customer care . They said to follow dealerships advise. Nothing else they could do. Emailed me the following

“We have investigated the matter related to ongoing limp mode concern with ………… At this point in time the team at ………… Toyota have conducted repairs in line with Toyota Australia's advice. We encourage you to follow the advice they have provided and if the concern reoccurs to contact your preferred Toyota Dealership.

If you are dissatisfied with our decision, we encourage you to seek independent legal advice. If you would like further information about your rights under the Australian Consumer Law, you may wish to read the Toyota Guest Charter (available at www.toyota.com.au/toyota-guest-charter) or visit the ACCC's website (at www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-guarantees).

 

[larry200]

"This clip explains it well . . . . https://autoexpert.com.au/posts/can-additives-clean-my-direct-injection-engine?rq=direct injection"

Just read this article. The argument makes absolute sense. You will probably find that unfortunately Toyota and others do not

perform tests simulating real life conditions when it comes to reducing pollution outputs. Different countries have different requirements

and one rule does not fit all. Some of us in the diesel world have taken to 'deleting' the EGR valve. In a diesel as opposed to a DI petrol

ICE, sooty exhaust gases combine with an oily fuel and form deposits (lots). The article points to a similar event occurring in a DI engine

because oily fumes are not washed away by the fuel.. Deleting the EGR may help. Ideally oily fumes need to be redirected as DI in the combustion

chamber.

Hope this all makes sense.