Where is my power?

[MRROLA]

Hello all.

I have a little bit of a problem.

I have had my Sportivo dyno'd twice now. Once before the CAI and once after.

The first dyno run, i produced only 103fwkw / 138hp. :(

With CAI the graph was a lot smoother, and had increased to 111.8fwkw / 150hp. :)

The dyno run's are done in 4th gear, is this the same as everyone elses run's?

Why do i not have the same sort of reading's as everyone else?

HELP?

Thanks

Sam

[LiMz RoLLa]

You can't compare your dyno figures to others. There are many factors which could produce different power figures. Eg. humidity, air temp, blahblah. So unless your car was dynoed with another stivo on the same day on the same dyno you can't really say you have less power.

[MRROLA]

I do know all those factor's.

But mine is like the lowest that i have ever seen.

Are all dyno run's done in 4th gear?

[Northy]

mate thats about the right power output for the given mods, dosent look like anything is wrong....

[KaZe-]

yer thats the same as me can som1 plz explain i went to a dyno day a couple weeks ago and i had 05 wif a trd cai wif k&n pod filter and i done the dyno i got 105 atw and my fren was also there wif his 04 stivo and he had a injen cai and he got 111 atw?? so yer not sure wat da hell is going on my car has done about 15k kms and his is about 60k kms dont know if somthings wrong or not

Cheers Steve,

[SuperDave]

Scan up the dyno printout so we can see what is happening.

[MR22ZZ]

where were they done Sam? I know the 1st was at SAS but what about the 2nd one?

bring them along tonight and I'll have a look... compare with mine...

[CORZZA]

as everyone says no two dyno will give you the exact same reading! And no two stivo will have the same kinda power!

but that power does seem about right for just a CAI.

diffrent stivos give diffrent readings!

[Dead]

Bah dyno's mean nothing to me Sam. 1/4 mile times speak for themselves. That's my motto.

[KaZe-]

CORRZA

come on man same dyno same day almost same time

105kw atw-

111kw atw-

:( somthings gotta be wrong. . . .

[SuperDave]

Has any part of the exhaust been modified/changed on your car? Did you get a baseline before the intake? Because there was a member on here with power around 95kW that ended up having Toyota replace his ECU, or something along those lines.

But we need to see a dyno printout to see what is happening, peak power doesn't explain much. Because you might have your peak at 7000, while the other car might have been at 8000. If the shop didn't give you a printout ring them up and ask for it.

[KaZe-]

thnx dave all i had was a trd cai wif a k&n pod and ive got a dyno print out of ill ill post it up when i take a photo of it and also mines a 2005 model not sure when it was made where can i find out?? 95kw >< that sux bad mayb i should try chucking on the old stock airbox then dynoing it?

Cheers Steve,

[sportiyo]

i dunno if its just me or what but on some days my car pulls pretty strong and on some other days(about the same temp) it doesnt pulls as strong...its got a mind of its own!

[KaZe-]

heres the dyno print out plz give me ur thoughts and things

and my car 0_0

[Rolla_Boy]

i thought sportivos where around 141kw?

[omn1potent]

i thought sportivos where around 141kw?

That figure as per other stated by manufacturers is at the flywheel (engine); not at the wheels as per dyno runs. Expect approximately a 20% reduction when calculating flywheel to wheels. Also don't forget that manufacturers also calculate a 10% tolerance to their engines.

Edited October 1, 2006 by omn1potent

[xoom]

CORRZA

come on man same dyno same day almost same time

105kw atw-

111kw atw-

:( somthings gotta be wrong. . . .

mate there are a number of things that can cause this 6kw difference mate.

1) tyre pressure

2) how tight the car was strapped down

3) the temperature

4) the humidity

and this is only to name a few.

Even though people say yes yes it was done on the same day on the same dyno so it should yield comparable results this is not 100% true.

I think people need to realize and understand a dyno is NOT A MEASUREMENT TOOL ..... but rather a benchmark tool which tells u @ that particular point in time with those particular conditions printed on the sheet the car was capable of producing that given power figure.

Someone correct me if i am wrong but i also believe dyno dynamics gurantees a variance of no more than 5% from dyno to dyno ?????? or was it 2% .... i cant remember so even then you will find a variance from going from place to place .....

Guys in all seriousness forget the dyno figures ..... u can be a dyno queen all u want but if the car doesnt pull the goods on the track what point is having this piece of paper that shows XXX kw's ?????

my 2kw worth ;) ;) ;)

[DANZZT231]

There's no point having a benchmark if there is nothing to measure. That is why Dyno is a measurement tool because you are trying to measure how far or close is your engine performance compared to the benchmark you made previously. Benchmark is the results obtained by measuring.

[Northy]

dyno looks fine, line is good....

[xoom]

There's no point having a benchmark if there is nothing to measure. That is why Dyno is a measurement tool because you are trying to measure how far or close is your engine performance compared to the benchmark you made previously. Benchmark is the results obtained by measuring.

So basically even if there is a 30min gap between dyno's ur saying that the measurements are 100% reflective of each other ?

If this is what ur saying then ur 110% wrong my friend.

Ive seen a twin turbo'ed supra gain over 20kw @ the wheels simply by tightening the straps holding it down.

If something as simple as this can throw the results how do u say its a measurement tool ?

A measurement tool is something that provides consistent reliable measurements time and time again e.g a ruler a CM is always a CM it never changes .... a voltmeter 1V is always 1V there is no external factors that influence it .....

Now if u r prepared 2 put ur hand on ur heart and say this is the case with a dyno then mate keep believing that as this is your own choice but those in the know relize what the real story is with dyno's & their figures.

As stated previously be a dyno queen all u want but if it hits the track and doesnt perform does the dyno figure actually mean anything ? Hence why performance car team after making a change to their setup hit the track NOT a dyno. But then again what do they know right ;) ;) ;)

[DANZZT231]

So you are saying you go to dyno to benchmark? I ask again, why do you benchmark when you are not measuring?

You have Power FC do you Xoom? You strap your car to dyno and let the tuning begin. Final results came out and what is the first thing you ask yourself? Most likely, how much power does this unit allow the engine to gain power. And then you compare by measuring the previous number with the current number. If you surpass the previous number, you have set new benchmark. If you haven't then the benchmark is not yet surpassed. But how do you know if you have surpassed this benchmark if you don't calculate and measure it?

So you are saying race team don't go to dyno do they? Hmm, thats a bold statement, you sure that's true Xoom? So why do you go to dyno to tune your Power FC then Xoom? Oh that's right, to tune it which requires a measure of air/flow, fuel, timing, and power. Now you haven't forgotten that have you? Race team will go to dyno, but they don't go there to win races. They go to dyno for the very same reason you go to tune your Power FC. What happened if you feel the car is bogging down? Dyno can be good, it can measure up critical data needed to diagnose your engine. Rich air/fuel mixture? Lean? Stoich? You don't tell me you use SAFC to find out all about that do you? Maybe you don't.

Personally I go to dyno to measure each progress of the modifications I made. Its not useless. Reliable figure? As long as the dyno is not mucked around, then yes. Different reading each time? Yes, but even day to day driving gives you different feel on the performance (hot and cold). Its nice to know what power it made on hot and winter. I'm not a dyno queen either.

If you said dyno is benchmark and not measurement tool due to unreliable reads, then no one here should buy CES - you support CES do you Xoom? You do. Because then it would make me feel, well, skeptic about the power gain. Even worse, its un-measurable figure.

So if you don't go to measure, and you go to benchmark - seems like you are the Dyno Queen over here, trying to set new benchmark for everyone to follow.

What do you think?

[MR22ZZ]

yer thats the same as me can som1 plz explain i went to a dyno day a couple weeks ago and i had 05 wif a trd cai wif k&n pod filter and i done the dyno i got 105 atw and my fren was also there wif his 04 stivo and he had a injen cai and he got 111 atw?? so yer not sure wat da hell is going on my car has done about 15k kms and his is about 60k kms dont know if somthings wrong or not

Cheers Steve,

Dude... you're comparing 2 completely different cars... I've seen stock Stivos from 105 to 115kw don't get your knickers in a knot of everything that is slightly different man.

CORRZA

come on man same dyno same day almost same time

105kw atw-

111kw atw-

:( somthings gotta be wrong. . . .

2 different cars...

[Dead]

Steve,

Be a man, do da right ting...

Buy Injen hahahahaha j/k

Yeah man it's all good, don't stress too much.

[Red_CT9A]

So you are saying you go to dyno to benchmark? I ask again, why do you benchmark when you are not measuring?

You have Power FC do you Xoom? You strap your car to dyno and let the tuning begin. Final results came out and what is the first thing you ask yourself? Most likely, how much power does this unit allow the engine to gain power. And then you compare by measuring the previous number with the current number. If you surpass the previous number, you have set new benchmark. If you haven't then the benchmark is not yet surpassed. But how do you know if you have surpassed this benchmark if you don't calculate and measure it?

So you are saying race team don't go to dyno do they? Hmm, thats a bold statement, you sure that's true Xoom? So why do you go to dyno to tune your Power FC then Xoom? Oh that's right, to tune it which requires a measure of air/flow, fuel, timing, and power. Now you haven't forgotten that have you? Race team will go to dyno, but they don't go there to win races. They go to dyno for the very same reason you go to tune your Power FC. What happened if you feel the car is bogging down? Dyno can be good, it can measure up critical data needed to diagnose your engine. Rich air/fuel mixture? Lean? Stoich? You don't tell me you use SAFC to find out all about that do you? Maybe you don't.

Personally I go to dyno to measure each progress of the modifications I made. Its not useless. Reliable figure? As long as the dyno is not mucked around, then yes. Different reading each time? Yes, but even day to day driving gives you different feel on the performance (hot and cold). Its nice to know what power it made on hot and winter. I'm not a dyno queen either.

If you said dyno is benchmark and not measurement tool due to unreliable reads, then no one here should buy CES - you support CES do you Xoom? You do. Because then it would make me feel, well, skeptic about the power gain. Even worse, its un-measurable figure.

So if you don't go to measure, and you go to benchmark - seems like you are the Dyno Queen over here, trying to set new benchmark for everyone to follow.

What do you think?

Edited October 1, 2006 by wei wei

[Dead]

Yes I saw that too Wei lol.

Hard for me to comment. Especially when you're friends with both of them