Air intake mods

[DJKOR]

I'm curious to see the result of the Fujita intake versus the stock intake with the resonators and activated carbon filter removed as I have done. Does it cost much to use a dyno? We have one here only 40 seconds down the road. I'd be willing to put mine on it for the sake of comparison.

Out of curiosity, why remove the carbon filter? I assume you are referring to the black canister that sits behind the engine, which is primarily designed to re-use vapor from the fuel?

No, not the charcoal canister. Messing with that would also introduce a MIL (Malfunction Indicator Light). I've heard of the MIL coming on over something as simple as a loose fuel tank cap. If the system is that sensitive, I wouldn't want to mess with it. That system is still intact, and still vents into the intake through the larger hose in the photo below.

In my post, I was referring to the activated carbon filter in the top of the air filter box (refer to picture below). That filter has the sole purpose of preventing any fuel vapor from exiting the intake and venting into the atmosphere. This filter only comes of use when the engine is off, so it plays no part in 'recycling' fuel vapors.

According to the service manual:

A carbon filter, which adsorbs the HC that accumulates in the intake system when the engine is stopped, is used in the air cleaner case in order to reduce evaporative emissions. This filter is maintenance-free.

[Freddo]

that is one weird intake setup hey. is it common?

go CAI in the fender!

[dave262]

I'm curious to see the result of the Fujita intake versus the stock intake with the resonators and activated carbon filter removed as I have done. Does it cost much to use a dyno? We have one here only 40 seconds down the road. I'd be willing to put mine on it for the sake of comparison.

Out of curiosity, why remove the carbon filter? I assume you are referring to the black canister that sits behind the engine, which is primarily designed to re-use vapor from the fuel?

No, not the charcoal canister. Messing with that would also introduce a MIL (Malfunction Indicator Light). I've heard of the MIL coming on over something as simple as a loose fuel tank cap. If the system is that sensitive, I wouldn't want to mess with it. That system is still intact, and still vents into the intake through the larger hose in the photo below.

In my post, I was referring to the activated carbon filter in the top of the air filter box (refer to picture below). That filter has the sole purpose of preventing any fuel vapor from exiting the intake and venting into the atmosphere. This filter only comes of use when the engine is off, so it plays no part in 'recycling' fuel vapors.

According to the service manual:

A carbon filter, which adsorbs the HC that accumulates in the intake system when the engine is stopped, is used in the air cleaner case in order to reduce evaporative emissions. This filter is maintenance-free.

I see... I wasn't even aware that there was now a carbon filter in the intake system too. That would be a requirement to get the EURO4 emissions compliance I would imagine.

Just shows that most my time working on cars has been with ancient things like Magna's that mostly don't even have a working catalytic converter any more!

[zr nate]

if dave262 and djkor could make it any clearer, i'd have a crack at it myself!

[Soloman]

Well guys installed my CAI on saturday.. tooke about 2-3 hours (inc lunch break). everything fit nice and snug..

first rev of the car once it was all installed i noticed a nice sound.. went for a drive and OMG it was unreal..

ok so most of you want to know if it is worth getting..

If you are going to get a exhaust or already have a exhaust system this is a must have.

The sound that comes out of the engine bay now when above 4000 rpm is loud.. turns heads..

there is def a pick up in the acceleration.. i find it reacts faster when you plant the foot now.. not so much lag as there was before.

I got no dyno or anything to prove this yet. but i am willing to get some.. or line up another aurion (v8toy's) and have a little drag race..

I got plenty of pics and im trying to get a good video/sound of what it is like (this is harder than you think)

Any questions post them up here and ill be happy to answer them..

[DJKOR]

Nice work mate. You should hit up v8toy and do a road dyno; I'm curious. It would be interesting to see the result. Don't let your mind play tricks on you though. When I unrestricted my intake, it sure sounded meaner when taken above 4000 RPM especially under load as well as 'feeling' like it had a better throttle response on launch. But I know my mind was just thinking that. My 0-100 time had absolutely no improvement, still sitting at 7.12 seconds.

On a side note, thanks to the 'learning' ECU and drive-by-wire, there is a quick way to get better throttle response. Once your car is warmed up (and your at a standstill obviously), stop the engine for about 30 seconds, then start it up again. Now give your car a 'good' run such as planting your foot down, redlining etc. Do that for a little bit (highways help) and you are bound to notice now that it will respond better. Though the next time you drive it in a relaxed style for a few minutes or so, it will start to chill out again.

[apg39]

Any questions post them up here and ill be happy to answer them..

Q: Where are the pics?

[dannywss]

Well guys installed my CAI on saturday.. tooke about 2-3 hours (inc lunch break). everything fit nice and snug..

first rev of the car once it was all installed i noticed a nice sound.. went for a drive and OMG it was unreal..

ok so most of you want to know if it is worth getting..

If you are going to get a exhaust or already have a exhaust system this is a must have.

The sound that comes out of the engine bay now when above 4000 rpm is loud.. turns heads..

there is def a pick up in the acceleration.. i find it reacts faster when you plant the foot now.. not so much lag as there was before.

I got no dyno or anything to prove this yet. but i am willing to get some.. or line up another aurion (v8toy's) and have a little drag race..

I got plenty of pics and im trying to get a good video/sound of what it is like (this is harder than you think)

Any questions post them up here and ill be happy to answer them..

good! drive for a day or 2 max, the ecu will study and get less air coming in and less sound. coz meantime, it is definately too much..

[Soloman]

http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lgim0036te6.jpg

Open the box

http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lgim0037dt1.jpg

Starting to pull the stock air box apart

http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lgim0038fv7.jpg

new intake installed (sorry for the blurry pic)

http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lgim0039wn9.jpg

The filter from under the car.

http://img237.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lgim0040cs3.jpg

the installed intake without the battery back in.

Edited August 24, 2008 by Soloman

[DJKOR]

good! drive for a day or 2 max, the ecu will study and get less air coming in and less sound. coz meantime, it is definately too much..

dannywss has a good point. It will still have the sound, but performance my go back to normal after a few days. This is how I imagine it:

Because it is drive-by-wire, the throttle valve position can be independent of accelerator position. These are comparative figures so you can get the gist of it. Eg. With stock intake, depressing the accelerator to 80% would open the throttle to 80%. The ECU knows how much air would have a baseline which knows how much air would be going through the engine at a given RPM. Now say you were to improve the intake and improve the air flow for the engine. Say this made a difference; when you depress the accelerator to 80%, it gets the equivalent amount of air intake as it would at say 85% on the accelerator. The ECU, not knowing that this is intentional, tries to make adjustments to make it match its baseline setup. As a result, the ECU adjusts the throttle valve to open to 75% whenever you depress the accelerator to 80%.

I dunno, what would happen at 100% accelerator since I'm pretty sure if you put your foot all the way to the floor, the throttle valve would open 100%, therefore if there were any gains, this would be where it would be noticed. That's just how I imagine the system to work. I guess the only way to find out is to connect some system up to all of it to do a full analysis of it all. That's what seems to happen with DBW cars.

[jonbays]

I can't believe how many people carry on about CAI and the performance gains they get from it still.

This is all marketing hype from the air filter and after market accessory people who want to rip you off.

None of this will make any measurable performance difference on an Aurion or any other modern well designed engine at all.

If you like the better under bonnet look and the extra noise then it works for you great but please dont tell me you can feel the extra power. To feel the extra power you would need to do something more dramatic to actually effect the efficiency of the pumping of the engine. I have changed cams in cars and swore it felt faster as the on cam rush felt good but on the dyno and at the dragstrip I was proved wrong. Just moving the power curve around. I can guarantee you CAI is going to do diddly squat for the performance of an Aurion.

[Freddo]

there is only one way to settle this great debate...

[apg39]

there is only one way to settle this great debate...

Zoolander style runway face off?

[apg39]

Yes I did search...

Has anyone got or experienced a K&N short ram intake like this?

Claimed 11HP increase. By the looks of the installed pictures it utilises the first part of the stock intake (over the radiator), just replaces the filter box. Hard to say it would have any more benefit than just installing a K&N filter in the stock box. Yeah?

[DJKOR]

Yes I did search...

Has anyone got or experienced a K&N short ram intake like this?

Claimed 11HP increase. By the looks of the installed pictures it utilises the first part of the stock intake (over the radiator), just replaces the filter box. Hard to say it would have any more benefit than just installing a K&N filter in the stock box. Yeah?

Yeah, looks like the interest in that one was short lived over here:

K&N Performance Intake Kit

LOL; shows that the rims were definitely worth more discussion. Anyways, the Americans over at the Toyota Nation forums have been talking about aftermarket intakes for the 2GR-FE. One thread I can direct you to: "K&N Typhoon or just stick with K&N drop-in filter?" They have pretty much come to the conclusion that a CAI or SRI is a waste of time and money. In the words of TRD VVTi:

Get the drop in filter and call it a day

[Freddo]

i'd still want a comparo dyno.

in your link to toyota nation there is nothing substantiating that there is no change.

time for a faceoff!

[DJKOR]

i'd still want a comparo dyno.

in your link to toyota nation there is nothing substantiating that there is no change.

time for a faceoff!

Do simple dyno runs just to obtain power/torque details cost much? If not, I can head down the road to my local dyno and get a graph for my Aurion. Only problem is, I've changed my intake ever so slightly so that it is not quite stock any more. Though my changes are ones that nearly all Aurion owners can do, so I guess in a way it can give an idea of what $30 vs. $350 can do. Even though I spent $30 on mine, I would be guessing it would be no different to a stock Aurion anyway, so the comparison would still be right.

[Freddo]

i'd still want a comparo dyno.

in your link to toyota nation there is nothing substantiating that there is no change.

time for a faceoff!

Do simple dyno runs just to obtain power/torque details cost much? If not, I can head down the road to my local dyno and get a graph for my Aurion. Only problem is, I've changed my intake ever so slightly so that it is not quite stock any more. Though my changes are ones that nearly all Aurion owners can do, so I guess in a way it can give an idea of what $30 vs. $350 can do. Even though I spent $30 on mine, I would be guessing it would be no different to a stock Aurion anyway, so the comparison would still be right.

a power run shouldn't cost that much - should be under $100. if u do a comparo with another aurion it has to be red too coz they goes faster!

[v8toy]

oooooooo i cant wait till i see this im in meekathara at the moment with the aussie safari so i wont be back until end of the month but we will def be lining them up on the dragstrip ofcourse hehe the other option we could do soloman isi will strap mine to the dyno which is stock besides 2 staino mufflers and then strap yours down and see what the diff is and post those readouts but like i say itll be a couple of weeks yet

[Soloman]

Well after a few days i still have the same sound.. still think my car is going a little bit faster. and it is more responsive when accelrating. i will still get me and v8toy to have a little head on.. he can take my car for a quick race see if he can feel it to.. dyno i might do but someone who has a stock car must do it too..

[intrigue]

I'm throwing up between the idea of Fujita CAI or just a K&N drop in filter?

Soloman: Just wondering what was the price (incl. postage)? and is the sound what i'd expect in the youtube video?

[Soloman]

$350 inc postage

the you tube video dont do it justice..

[intrigue]

$350 inc postage

the you tube video dont do it justice..

so i shouldn't get it?

$350 usd right?

[Soloman]

it will sound better.. :)

[dave262]

Any performance gains you are seeing are not completely outrageous, but there is some science in the intake system...

V6 intakes are a complex configuration, as there are many tricks that have been developed over the years to try and blend fuel economy with performance. One such trick is a couple of valves within the air intake system that open and close at certain engine RPM points. One of these valves is the mod that has been mentioned numerous times on this site that involves the swapping of vacuum hoses. The theory is that by altering the length of the intake piping, different air resonance patterns can be created which have an effect on the flow of air into the engine. At low RPM points, you will find that both valves will be closed, allowing limited airflow through the intake system and a shorter path. This allows for the improved efficiency. At higher RPM's, one or both valves will open and vary the length of the intake system and allow greater flow of air through the system. This system has been around for many years, and has proven to be extremely effective in particular on V6 engines. It is very rarely seen on 4 cylinder engines.

Something that many people don't realise is that those "resonators" (or so everyone calls them) that are removed going to a CAI actually have a purpose other than just reducing the intake noise. They serve as a "reserve" for additional air during the times where you might suddenly try to accelerate and a large amount of air is required quickly. As the air intake system generally does not have much vacuum at steady low RPM, when sudden acceleration occurs the engine will create a relatively large temporary vacuum within the intake. This causes a delay in the amount of air that is able to reach the engine and will cause a more "peaky" surge of acceleration due to the sudden surge of airflow and change of vacuum. By having a tank at the intermediary point, this can be reduced. With intakes as large as the Aurion has, airflow is already far slower than a smaller intake, which necessitates even more need for a surge tank or "resonator". With this in mind, by removing the resonators and adding a CAI, you will indeed obtain a far beefier sound to your intake, but you will not necessarily make any gains unless you are at high RPM.

In addition, the length and diameter of the new intake can have an effect on performance that cannot reliably be predicted. Some engines perform better with longer intakes, and others perform better with shorter intakes. Also affected will be the responsiveness and the RPM point at which the CAI will start to make a difference. There is also the consideration about the air temperature which alters the density of the air, which in turn affects other parameters of the engine behavior. Short intakes will for obvious reasons suck air from hotter sections of the engine bay, while longer ones may be able to obtain cooler air. Different materials may also have an effect due to thermal properties and their behavior under vacuum.

Finally, an intake modification alone may not necessarily make a huge difference unless you consider other aspects of the engine too. Some modifications may make a huge difference to the overall behavior of the engine and could even require something as significant as a new ECU to understand how to map the new intake behavior with fuel mappings. More free-flowing exhausts will have a larger impact than an intake also, as generally stock exhaust systems are designed for a cost rather than for great flow.

Just a little "light" reading for those of u who can be bothered =P