Tyres for your Aurion

[Tony Prodigy]

1 hour ago, campbeam said:

 

Have a look at this YouTube video then go have a look at the sidewall of your tyres.

 

Unfortunately, most tyre manufacturer’s websites do not include the treadwear rating for their different tyres plus other specification e.g. depth of tread etc.

 

Can’t have facts getting in the way of marketing’s subjective statements especially when comparing tyres. Guess you have to ask specific questions to get specific answers.

 

Interesting video Ash. I had a quick look and snapped this photo just now of my Primacy LC data on the sidewall.

Mine says 280 for treadwear. What does that even mean ? Tires have lasted over 60K so how does the "280" equate to this you think ?

 

[Tony Prodigy]

 

  Taken from suspension thread 

  On 10/18/2020 at 6:20 AM, Tony Prodigy said:

New set of Primacy LCs purchased at 59447K replacing the original, can't even remember what they were.

Then at 91107, two new fronts purchased and existing fronts moved to the back.

Now at 123,050, which is 31.943K later, the whole set has reached end of life practically.

 

  On 10/18/2020 at 2:00 PM, donnot said:

Ouch, 31,000 k's isn't great

Just had a re read of my previous response and I was wrong on some points. I have to clarify.

I purchased a full set of Primacy LCs when it was at 59447, then at 91107, I decided to put new fronts on was because the alignment went out and it was kinda late to do another alignment and as a result the left tyre wore prematurely on the outer edge and I was concerned about this. It was then I decided to put two new front tyres and left the rear tyres as they were because they still had plenty tread left. Now, with a good full set, the fronts naturally will wear down a bit quicker than the rears and to get the most out of this set. Then at approximately 110k , I rotated the fronts to the back and backs to the fronts to get more life out of the still chunky rears. Have I confused you a bit more now ? 

Now I have the rear left tyre chewing the outer edge out and it's practically smooth only on the outer edge. All the other three are still ok with minor dry rot and will easily go another 10-15k, but that left rear will be lucky to see another 3 to 5k. So I think I'll just bit the bullet and just replace the whole set out as this will give me the opportunity to try another version of Michelins.

So overall, these tyres, if wheel alignment is good, will last at least 60k or more. Remember though, even at this point with good tread depth, the age will always catch up as you will see dry rot between the grooves. I'll post my tyre conditions in my tyre thread.

 

[campbeam]

24 minutes ago, Tony Prodigy said:

Mine says 280 for treadwear. What does that even mean ?

It means that you need to have another look at the video. It is a comparative figure.

My front Dunlop tyres have 240 for treadwear and rear Pirelli tyres have 420 for treadwear.

420= 1.75 times 240. Therefore, the Pirelli tyre should last 75% longer than the Dunlop in the same controlled conditions. Then, we have real world conditions with so many variable of road surface, temperature, speed etc.

[ZZT86]

6 hours ago, Tony Prodigy said:

I love Michelin tyres and I've got two in mind. 1st would be the Pilot Sport 4 and my second choice would be the Primacy 4.

Well Tony if you wait a while I will let you know cos as of this morning I slapped a full set of PS4's on my car - ouch !

The Primacy 4 was also on the radar but I have read too many people whinging with skittish/slippy in wet comments & vague steering which is odd for a Michelin as they usually make a brilliant tyre, reason why they cost so much.

First impressions of the PS4 is smooth, quiet, responsive & effortless. I expect them to last at least 30-40K kms considering my mostly non aggressive / fwy driving. I also came across another dude (in the dark web) with the exact same car who also has the PS4's & reckons they're lasting a long time thus far although he mostly drives on hwy.

The PS4 imo is like an entry level performance tyre which isn't too hard or too soft which I thought would suit my Sportivos stiff setup. They're a very grippy tyre & they rate highly amongst many for overall performance. The PS4S is a stiffer/higher performance version of the PS4 although limited in size availability.

I will report back after 5-10K kms especially in wet.

Edited October 20, 2020 by ZZT86

[Tony Prodigy]

7 hours ago, campbeam said:

It means that you need to have another look at the video. It is a comparative figure.

I'll have to rewatch the video. 

[Tony Prodigy]

17 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

Well Tony if you wait a while I will let you know cos as of this morning I slapped a full set of PS4's on my car - ouch !

Haha Nice ! Exactly what I was hoping for  Price wise, I've noticed they are only a couple bucks more than the Primacy 4 at my local Bob Jane. 

https://www.bobjane.com.au/a/215-55r17-tyres/michelin/pilot-sport-4-215-55zr17-98w/9709?variant_id=9709

https://www.bobjane.com.au/a/215-55r17-tyres/michelin/primacy-4-215-55r17-94v/13188?variant_id=13188

17 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

The Primacy 4 was also on the radar but I have read too many people whinging with skittish/slippy in wet comments & vague steering which is odd for a Michelin as they usually make a brilliant tyre, reason why they cost so much.

This is the thing with tyres. Too many variables to make a definitive call. Different cars, makes and models will react differently and it's weird how some will provide a glowing report and others not so. Are they just being pedantic or are their cars just not suited for such a tyre. ?? It's so hard until you've actually tried several tyres yourself and hopefully find the one that fits like a glove. 

 

17 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

First impressions of the PS4 is smooth, quiet, responsive & effortless. I expect them to last at least 30-40K kms considering my mostly non aggressive

Good to hear. Effortless steering response would be something I'd love to experience as the Aurion's steering is a little heavy on mine. Could it be the electric assisted steering ? Don't know. I really won't know until I get the new tyres and if they happen to be the PS4's, I will certainly know then.

If they last between 40 and 50k, I'd be happy with that, because proper tyre degradation creeps in at this point and even if your tyres will go beyond this, as is the case with my current Primacy LC's, you will get dry rot which is not ideal. So there is a caveat with long lasting tyres. Yes, they will push the budget further but at what expense ? Having old, hard and dry rotting tyres just so you can drive another 10k isn't a safe option for me.

17 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

The PS4 imo is like an entry level performance tyre which isn't too hard or too soft which I thought would suit my Sportivos stiff setup. They're a very grippy tyre & they rate highly amongst many for overall performance. The PS4S is a stiffer/higher performance version of the PS4 although limited in size availability.

I'd draw the line on the PS4's for my Aurion. No need to go one better. I think the PS4's are on the money. 

Edited October 21, 2020 by Tony Prodigy

[L4WL3SS]

$192 each is a no brainer. 

If only they were that cheap in 235/45/18 😭

[L4WL3SS]

Also, if your getting a full set of whatever, don't be afraid to play tyre shops against each other. See what kind of deal they can do, even if it's only 10 bucks off each tyre

[Tony Prodigy]

36 minutes ago, Metal_Head said:

Also, if your getting a full set of whatever, don't be afraid to play tyre shops against each other. See what kind of deal they can do, even if it's only 10 bucks off each tyre

Don't worry about that. I'm not shy when it comes to the haggle 😄

[Tony Prodigy]

1 hour ago, Metal_Head said:

$192 each is a no brainer. 

If only they were that cheap in 235/45/18 😭

I feel your pain mate. Tyres for my M3 are roughly $450 a piece ! Ouch !

[L4WL3SS]

Cheaper to ditch the run flats & and buy a full size spare & "downgrade" tyre choice me thinks

[Tony Prodigy]

1 minute ago, Metal_Head said:

Cheaper to ditch the run flats & and buy a full size spare & "downgrade" tyre choice me thinks

Yes I totally agree if it did have run flats. They are a rubbish tyre for starters and was designed for those who don't know or don't want to change a flat.

Mine's an old school E36 M3. Run flats weren't even invented back then lol, not that I'd have them anyway. Back then they actually did give you a full sized spare. 

It has a staggered set up. 255/40/R17 rears and 225/45/R17 fronts. MIchelin Pilot Preceda tyres. I don't think they even make these anymore to be honest.

Next set will probably be the Cup 2's

[L4WL3SS]

Ah OK, don't know much about euros. My dad has a Mercedes, with expensive run flats as standard, and he contemplated buying a spare wheel & buy cheaper tyres when it came time to replace them, but as most older people like to do, he decided to keep things "stock" 

[Tony Prodigy]

43 minutes ago, Metal_Head said:

Ah OK, don't know much about euros. My dad has a Mercedes, with expensive run flats as standard, and he contemplated buying a spare wheel & buy cheaper tyres when it came time to replace them, but as most older people like to do, he decided to keep things "stock" 

All good mate. The run flats may suit some people but they are quite expensive and really unnecessary.  I like to keep my cars stock too but stuff like tyres don't really count in my books. I can respect your Dad's decision to keep it as it came. Nothing wrong with that either. They're not for everyone. I know of Rolls Royce owners who have sworn off the run flats and just go with high quality aftermarkets.

[KAA]

Same comment Tony, run flats are not for everyone..cost alone would stop me even thinking of them..I have a full size spare and a jack..I choose to keep my Presara Stock as I love it the way it is..fits all my needs and wants..well I do have 1 want..but I doubt CHIP FOOSE would come to NSW and do a OVERHAULIN episode..but if he did I would gladly hand over my keys and say do what you wish..but as that will never happen it is stock, some debadging, altered grill and the best tyres I can afford

KAA

 

[ZZT86]

16 hours ago, Tony Prodigy said:

1:  This is the thing with tyres. Too many variables to make a definitive call.

2:  Good to hear. Effortless steering response would be something I'd love to experience as the Aurion's steering is a little heavy on mine. Could it be the electric assisted steering ? Don't know. I really won't know until I get the new tyres and if they happen to be the PS4's, I will certainly know then.

3: If they last between 40 and 50k, I'd be happy with that

4:  I'd draw the line on the PS4's for my Aurion. No need to go one better. I think the PS4's are on the money. 

1: Correct ! All very subjective, what I call quiet some would say a little noisy, actually there is a slight roar from the tyres from about 95km/h although hard to pick on my car as the road surface isn't the best, even freeways, car could do with more insulation also. Mine were certainly not $192 a pop (I wish), they were $262 ea + $50 w/a. 225/45/18 are bloody expensive, even more so than the 86 for a similar size. So many variables to factor in including size, car suspension setup, type of driving & driver behaviour, aggressive from standing start or gentle all play their part in longevity. Wouldn't surprise me if the Primacy 4 are actually a great tyre, personally I'm only going off internet & tyre expert tests & feedback. I can report economy is unchanged on my PS4 which is excellent.

2: I noticed not long ago that my car doesn't have a hydraulic power steer reservoir, presume no pump either making it solely full electric. It works fine now with these tyres. Shop rec 38psi to keep that tread flat for the life of the tyre. This may very well be part of the reason why it feels so effortless.

3: All depends on the driving. I'm guestimating I'll get a decent life out of mine.

4: YMMV - for me so far so good

[Tony Prodigy]

7 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

1: Correct ! All very subjective, what I call quiet some would say a little noisy, actually there is a slight roar from the tyres from about 95km/h although hard to pick on my car as the road surface isn't the best, even freeways, car could do with more insulation also. Mine were certainly not $192 a pop (I wish), they were $262 ea + $50 w/a. 225/45/18 are bloody expensive, even more so than the 86 for a similar size. So many variables to factor in including size, car suspension setup, type of driving & driver behaviour, aggressive from standing start or gentle all play their part in longevity. Wouldn't surprise me if the Primacy 4 are actually a great tyre, personally I'm only going off internet & tyre expert tests & feedback. I can report economy is unchanged on my PS4 which is excellent.

I would go as far and say that all Michelin Tyres by virtue of their design are quiet compared to most other brands. Other brands will have a mix of quiet and "noisy" tyres depending on the type of tread design too. Michelin have worked hard in this dept and this is what makes them stand out from the rest in my opinion. I'm happy to pay the bit extra.

Unfortunately, the larger the diameter, the more expensive the tyre. I would also think that tyre degradation would also be accelerated due to the higher performance aspect of these too. Would this be true ? I've never had 18' wheel/tyre combo to know this.

7 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

2: I noticed not long ago that my car doesn't have a hydraulic power steer reservoir, presume no pump either making it solely full electric. It works fine now with these tyres. Shop rec 38psi to keep that tread flat for the life of the tyre. This may very well be part of the reason why it feels so effortless.

True. The 50 series has electric assisted power steering. No more hydraulic issues to worry about. One less service job too lol. Just on the 38 psi thing again. I'm going to try this pressure on and see how it feels. 

 

7 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

3: All depends on the driving. I'm guestimating I'll get a decent life out of mine.

4: YMMV - for me so far so good

My wife drives our car 95% of the time so I'm not expecting hard feathered edges 😂 so I always expect good mileage if it weren't for the damned front left edge wearing out prematurely. I'm going to make this bone of contention with my tyre guy and see what he reckons. I'll also mention tyre pressure too. Would I be paranoid thinking him wanting 36 psi so the tyres can wear out faster ?? Is 38 psi the magic number I wonder..

The inside edges have bugger all wear. It's just the outers more so. The left rear is also as bad the front left. Only the left side it seems.

[campbeam]

1 hour ago, Tony Prodigy said:

Would I be paranoid thinking him wanting 36 psi so the tyres can wear out faster ?? Is 38 psi the magic number I wonder..

The inside edges have bugger all wear. It's just the outers more so. The left rear is also as bad the front left. Only the left side it seems.

Incorrect paranoid thinking. If you want faster tyre wear, try lower tyre pressures. I have always used 36 psi for at least 20 years. Been doing that for the last 5 years with my Aurion. I have also increased the tyre pressures up to 38 psi then 40 psi. At the same time I have been checking and there is no noticeable tyre wear in the centre due to over-inflation. Suggest that you look at your owners manual for the recommended tyre pressures for highway speed with 4 occupants. As for the 40 psi, it is more laziness on my part because I only check tyre pressures monthly.

Same as yourself, inner edges have little wear but the outer is wearing more. Certainly interested in getting this sorted out before fitting the next set of tyres.

[Tony Prodigy]

4 minutes ago, campbeam said:

Incorrect paranoid thinking. If you want faster tyre wear, try lower tyre pressures. I have always used 36 psi for at least 20 years. Been doing that for the last 5 years with my Aurion. I have also increased the tyre pressures up to 38 psi then 40 psi. At the same time I have been checking and there is no noticeable tyre wear in the centre due to over-inflation. Suggest that you look at your owners manual for the recommended tyre pressures for highway speed with 4 occupants. As for the 40 psi, it is more laziness on my part because I only check tyre pressures monthly.

Same as yourself, inner edges have little wear but the outer is wearing more. Certainly interested in getting this sorted out before fitting the next set of tyres.

Thanks for putting my mind to rest Ash. So 36-38 would be the sweet spot. 

I haven't got a decent air compressor at this point and regular pressure checks are difficult unless I drive to a local garage, if I remember...

My compressor is back home at my folk's place and have no intention of moving it from there because I use it there for other things, so I have to purchase another one for my garage here at some point. That will make it a lot easier for me having a decent tyre inflator.

I have one of those little portable 12v dragon tyre inflator (with digital readout) but it's a little painful to use and slow. I just keep it in the Aurion's boot in case my wife has a small emergency, she can pull up anywhere and put air in the tyre. For a full inflation it takes too long.

I wonder if the alignment can be made so that it can add some more negative camber above and over what the spec calls for so that it can even out with time.

Not an easy thing this suspension geometry..

[campbeam]

16 minutes ago, Tony Prodigy said:

Thanks for putting my mind to rest Ash. So 36-38 would be the sweet spot. 

I haven't got a decent air compressor at this point and regular pressure checks are difficult unless I drive to a local garage, if I remember...

My compressor is back home at my folk's place and have no intention of moving it from there because I use it there for other things, so I have to purchase another one for my garage here at some point. That will make it a lot easier for me having a decent tyre inflator.

I have one of those little portable 12v dragon tyre inflator (with digital readout) but it's a little painful to use and slow. I just keep it in the Aurion's boot in case my wife has a small emergency, she can pull up anywhere and put air in the tyre. For a full inflation it takes too long.

I wonder if the alignment can be made so that it can add some more negative camber above and over what the spec calls for so that it can even out with time.

Not an easy thing this suspension geometry..

I have found that 36-38 psi is ideal for my Aurion. Certainly helps to make the tyre sidewalls a bit firmer so improves steering responsiveness. I just use the local garages and 40 psi on their gauge or maybe 41 psi. When I do remember [and then not forget] tyre pressures are usually down to 37-38 psi. Recently I bought a tyre pressure gauge and did check the tyre pressures at home.

You were previously in a thread about the wheel alignment specifications. You must not have had the time to read/scan all of the posts. Camber adjustment bolts may be enough otherwise there is a kit to replace a bushing in the lower control arm.

[Tony Prodigy]

On 10/21/2020 at 6:42 PM, KAA said:

Same comment Tony, run flats are not for everyone..cost alone would stop me even thinking of them..I have a full size spare and a jack..I choose to keep my Presara Stock as I love it the way it is.

We are the privileged few who still have a full sized spare these days as we're heading into this era of so called "space saver" tyres. The notion that it is called a space saver is ridiculous because it isn't really about saving space is it ? It's cheaper to give you a clown wheel and it also compensates for the increase in weight the cars get from the overload of techy gadgets. I like having a proper, full sized spare wheel. The only downside of having the full sized spare, that is fair to say, is that some may not be able to handle the weight while trying to lift it out of the boot. That's probably the only con.

On 10/21/2020 at 6:42 PM, KAA said:

CHIP FOOSE would come to NSW and do a OVERHAULIN episode..

Foose is a Legend. I think he'd get bored pretty quickly here compared to the U.S. The Yanks sure know how to build cars. They are the Kings of Custom.

The Count, Danny Koker from Count's Kustoms is one that comes to mind, including Richard Rawlins from Gas Monkey Garage. Amazing stuff.

On 10/21/2020 at 6:42 PM, KAA said:

but as that will never happen it is stock, some debadging, altered grill and the best tyres I can afford

Ah so you're a de-badger. I have a mate who debadges everything too, except his M3. It's sacrilege to debadge an original M3 actually, that's why he's never attempted that. Same goes for mine lol..  I'm the opposite, I actually love the badging. I even have several spare badges I purchased from Toyota to replace any that may need replacing for whatever reason. 

[campbeam]

3 hours ago, Tony Prodigy said:

We are the privileged few who still have a full sized spare these days as we're heading into this era of so called "space saver" tyres. The notion that it is called a space saver is ridiculous because it isn't really about saving space is it ? It's cheaper to give you a clown wheel and it also compensates for the increase in weight the cars get from the overload of techy gadgets. I like having a proper, full sized spare wheel. The only downside of having the full sized spare, that is fair to say, is that some may not be able to handle the weight while trying to lift it out of the boot. That's probably the only con.

It is a right not a privilege and I want it now and forever. Our good mate John is not holding back when he calls space saver tyres a fraud. You need a full size spare if you do any highway driving. I also check the tyre pressure of the spare tyre before I go on a road trip. Better to be prepared rather than sorry with a spare with only 20 psi that you have not checked for years.

If you cannot handle the weight, then pay to have roadside assistance. If you are lucky, someone may stop to assist.

https://autoexpert.com.au/posts/top-six-things-new-car-buyers-dont-check-but-should

[L4WL3SS]

As is the case with dad's merc, there isn't even a space saver wheel, hence the need for the run flats

[Tony Prodigy]

13 minutes ago, Metal_Head said:

As is the case with dad's merc, there isn't even a space saver wheel, hence the need for the run flats

At least your Dad's car got the run flats. My friend's E46 M3 has neither a spare and run flats are ridiculously impossible for a high performance BMW, so the latter is no option.  If he ever gets a flat, he'll either have to do a tyre repair on the go or call road service. I do believe they provide a small air compressor too If I remember correctly. My M3 was the last Gen to his E46 (E36/ 90's car) to carry a full sized ///M wheel ( it's a front wheel actually cos the rear are much larger) so it can fit either end.

[Tony Prodigy]

45 minutes ago, campbeam said:

It is a right not a privilege and I want it now and forever.

Tell that to the bean counters lol. They'll always have some justification for the stupid decisions that befall the car industry. I remember the first time I saw a space saver wheel and I laugh my head off. It was even funnier when you saw one on a car getting around town. They are not for highway driving as you mentioned Ash, more of a band aid to get you to visit a tyre shop asap. If You were planning a highway trip with a car equipped only with a clown wheel, I'd buy a full sized spare and throw it in the boot in defiance of the manufacturer. You never know when you'll need it.