Lift In The Stivo

[thegourou20]

Hello Guys,

I have been driving my stivo around for a few days now. The car still drives like a treat and everything but I have the feeling lately when i hit lift, it is not as sudden and powerful as it used to be. I am not sure whether it is just my imagination because i might be already used to drive it or it is definitely something, which is triggering this. My first thought was may be the ECU has may be tuned itself up so that the car runs smoothly? Also, the car just came from a minor service and they said there was a leak with the water pump. Obviously, i asked whether it was gonna make the engine overheat and stuff. They said no the car will be fine but it will need to be replaced in the near future.

Then i came across the following on the forum:

How does VVTL-i work?

The Toyota 2ZZ-GE features different sets of cam lobes on both the inlet and exhaust camshafts for low/medium and high engine speeds. When the engine speed exceeds 6000r/min and the engine water temperature exceeds 60 degrees Centigrade, the ECU activates an oil control valve that pressurises oil passages in the inlet and exhaust camshafts. This activates a cam changeover mechanism on each set of cam lobes which ‘locks’ the cam rollers onto the high-speed cam profiles. The result is that the lift of the intake and exhaust valves is extended, enhancing the engine's 'breathing' and power.

And now i am starting to think that actually that "leak" associated with the water pump might be triggering the issue.

I would appreciate if you guys could give me some advice about what to do.

[jaderd]

not sure that it would mate.....the temp of 60 degrees is basically to allow lift to either happen or not happen....ie fuel cut and die (bad feeling lol) so above 60 degrees lift works below it doesnt...i dont think you can get any inbetween at all.....maybe unless its at above 60 when lift starts and it drops below 60 during lift and therefore it dies? dont think that could be occuring though.

i reckon its just you getting used to it..........chuck a CAI on and that will keep you happy for ages i think.....you can feel the diff but i guess more noticeable is the noise increase of induction

[Brad-dreama]

i have to agreee too.

considering my car was driven by a family could the ecu learn to tone itsself down?

i remember a few years ago getting in my mates stivo and it lifted alot harder from what i recall.

any ideas?

[Blind Kid Seeks]

nomal operating temp for a stivo is around 85 degrees C..... If anything... if you're losing water... your engine wil get hotter faster.

engine temp doesnt drop below 85 degrees, not matter how much air you're putting hrough the radiator... thats wat the thermostat is for.

it always feels diff when your a passenger as opposed to the driver....

many thngs change how lift feels... like which gear your in.. obviously lift wont kick as hard in 2nd as it does in 1st. ...

bear in mind also, that there is a period of engagement (about 200 rpm between 6000 and 6200) the stock ecu pulls timing from the engine... so that the lift kick feels hard. you may be noticing the engagement period dropping or decreasing.. or ou're ready for it. i dunno.. but unless your losing oil pressure lift mechanically should be fine

just as a note... having the high cam kick in the way it does isnt a good thing, especially if your negotiating a long sweeping bend on the threshold of understeer at full noise.

[whitestivo]

Í would only hit lift two or three times a week generally, and my wife is yet to really hit redline, and she drives it more than i do.

However, when I go to the track and live in lift, what you notice is that it takes the first session, and then your times drop 2 seconds. I can't put that all down to skill straight away. The car just goes like an absolute demon, as if it just opens her up.

I especially love wheel spinning out of turn 3, hitting near redline, then the tyres grip, it drops to 6500, and you do a double lift.

Not sure you should be gettnig on the gas as you described in the corner, slow in, fast out is the way to do it.

whitestivo

[Blind Kid Seeks]

Í would only hit lift two or three times a week generally, and my wife is yet to really hit redline, and she drives it more than i do.

However, when I go to the track and live in lift, what you notice is that it takes the first session, and then your times drop 2 seconds. I can't put that all down to skill straight away. The car just goes like an absolute demon, as if it just opens her up.

I especially love wheel spinning out of turn 3, hitting near redline, then the tyres grip, it drops to 6500, and you do a double lift.

Not sure you should be gettnig on the gas as you described in the corner, slow in, fast out is the way to do it.

whitestivo

yeah of course...

but if you approach to slow and you're on the gas early powering out... then theres a chance you'll hit that magic 6.2k marker and break traction.

i tuned that "kick" out of my powercurve, so no need for me to worry bout it now. its just a Toyota ECU sales Pitch.

[thegourou20]

Well I noticed a change in the intensity of the lift even though I still can hear it and feel it somehow. i am like 65% sure it definitely drop in the way it is kicking it as i do not feel that sudden boost/rush that much. That happened on one of those really hot day last week and i must admit i was a bit keen on the accelerator as i only had the car for a couple of days. Since then I am also constantly checking the temperature guage to try and see if there is any change in temperature but i cannot find any difference. Should i try and reset the ECU or may be the there is something wrong with the oil? (thinking might be burnt and turn crap already... )

[Blind Kid Seeks]

Well I noticed a change in the intensity of the lift even though I still can hear it and feel it somehow. i am like 65% sure it definitely drop in the way it is kicking it as i do not feel that sudden boost/rush that much. That happened on one of those really hot day last week and i must admit i was a bit keen on the accelerator as i only had the car for a couple of days. Since then I am also constantly checking the temperature guage to try and see if there is any change in temperature but i cannot find any difference. Should i try and reset the ECU or may be the there is something wrong with the oil? (thinking might be burnt and turn crap already... )

Hey mate,

its highly unlikely that you're oil is causing the problems.. but for peice of mind.. you can do both the ECU and the Oil change. def cant hurt doing some routine maintainence....

if you're really worried bout it...

i'm sure one of us can take it for a spin for you and let you know what we think

[thegourou20]

Sounds Good Andy...I will try the ECU reset and oil change this weekend and let you know how i go.

As for the offer for the spin, i was thinking when you get the bearing kit ready may be i can drive pass to pick it up and then you can drive it so that you can gimme some feedback how does that sound?

Btw Simon, I have been looking around for CAI here and there while i am waiting for some funds. So far, i am tossing between the TRD (@ 370ish delivered) v.s CES ($537 delivered) i am leaning towards the TRD one because it is cheaper and apparently there is not any major difference between both.

[evoke]

I think heat also affects the power of LIFT.

We've been having quite a few hot days in Melb. But I dont have facts to back my theory.

[Madrox]

i have often thought that myself.

i get used to the speed and power of things very quickly.

when i bought the car i couldn't open it up for a few days because i was worried about losing it.

when i finally did open it up it was unreal for a few days.

now i can open it up and it doesn't feel anywhere near as good as what it did.

in my sx the vvt would kick in at 4000 and give a real boost but i got used to it and hardly ever felt it after that.

i get my mates to jmp in my car and take it for a thrash and they still feel it as much as i did the first few times.

[runxz]

I dno what year u have bud, but i had a similar problem with my 01 runx. I changed out my lift bolts and my lift is exactly the same always. Mine being a 01 had the lame softer lift bolts. I believe all 2zzge's from 03 on had the new stronger bolts installed from the factory. I will also add thow that when u hit lift on a nice cold night i realy feels hella more dred than in the day so make sure u talking about the same kinda ambient temps. :)

[the_random_hero]

I think heat also affects the power of LIFT.

We've been having quite a few hot days in Melb. But I dont have facts to back my theory.

I'd say if the ambient air temps are up, your ECU will retard timing (as most will), which will make the transition into lift way less noticeable.

I think most of the time people talking about "losing" lift is more to do with them getting used to it than anything else.

[SILVABULLIT]

Sounds Good Andy...I will try the ECU reset and oil change this weekend and let you know how i go.

As for the offer for the spin, i was thinking when you get the bearing kit ready may be i can drive pass to pick it up and then you can drive it so that you can gimme some feedback how does that sound?

Btw Simon, I have been looking around for CAI here and there while i am waiting for some funds. So far, i am tossing between the TRD (@ 370ish delivered) v.s CES ($537 delivered) i am leaning towards the TRD one because it is cheaper and apparently there is not any major difference between both.

CES CAI is 3" and the TRD is like 66mm? From memory or close to 2.75". CES CAI also has a reducer in the pipe near the maf to incease air speed through the maf. Rubber elbows of the TRD are also quite thin and flimsy compared to the ones CES used which make it a tad harder to manipulate into the right spot but no need to worry about the hose clamps cutting the rubber elbow like the TRD can do.

[CHA54]

TRD intake is made from 70mm alloy tube. Metric size, lighter with a nice CNC'd MAF flange. The 70mm size suits the MAF just as TRD designed it and doesn't require a reducer. If you want to replace the rubber elbow with a silicone item you can buy one from Grant at Otomoto who are a toymods forum sponsor for ~$30.

Edited February 7, 2009 by CHA54

[spillige]

Sounds Good Andy...I will try the ECU reset and oil change this weekend and let you know how i go.

As for the offer for the spin, i was thinking when you get the bearing kit ready may be i can drive pass to pick it up and then you can drive it so that you can gimme some feedback how does that sound?

Btw Simon, I have been looking around for CAI here and there while i am waiting for some funds. So far, i am tossing between the TRD (@ 370ish delivered) v.s CES ($537 delivered) i am leaning towards the TRD one because it is cheaper and apparently there is not any major difference between both.

CES CAI is 3" and the TRD is like 66mm? From memory or close to 2.75". CES CAI also has a reducer in the pipe near the maf to incease air speed through the maf. Rubber elbows of the TRD are also quite thin and flimsy compared to the ones CES used which make it a tad harder to manipulate into the right spot but no need to worry about the hose clamps cutting the rubber elbow like the TRD can do.

lol u ces fan boys crack me up...... thegourou20 if your in sydney try plazmaman cai its a good kit

[xoom]

try plazmaman cai its a good kit

editted:

oh found it

http://plazmaman.com/shop/index.php?action...m&itemId=83

Toyota Sportivo Pod Air filter Induction kit 00+

*** ON SPECIAL **** Cold air induction piping kits to suit pod style air filters. Give your engine the cold it requires and pick up approx 10 hp by just bolting on this large diameter kit. Gives the vehicle a tough grunty induction roar and comes with inbuilt welded on fitting to suit the factory air flow meter . Pipes are mirror polished , all silicone and aero clamps supplied . K&N chrome filter supplied .

Dimensions: polished aluminium

Price: $345.00

[neil trama]

Three things come to mind here:

1) If tappet clearances have closed up lift can fail to engage on the affected cylinders.

2) If a lift bolt is broken, lift can fail to engage on the relevant camshaft.

3) If the engine is too cold, the ecu will prevent lift engaging.

Neil

[SILVABULLIT]

Sounds Good Andy...I will try the ECU reset and oil change this weekend and let you know how i go.

As for the offer for the spin, i was thinking when you get the bearing kit ready may be i can drive pass to pick it up and then you can drive it so that you can gimme some feedback how does that sound?

Btw Simon, I have been looking around for CAI here and there while i am waiting for some funds. So far, i am tossing between the TRD (@ 370ish delivered) v.s CES ($537 delivered) i am leaning towards the TRD one because it is cheaper and apparently there is not any major difference between both.

CES CAI is 3" and the TRD is like 66mm? From memory or close to 2.75". CES CAI also has a reducer in the pipe near the maf to incease air speed through the maf. Rubber elbows of the TRD are also quite thin and flimsy compared to the ones CES used which make it a tad harder to manipulate into the right spot but no need to worry about the hose clamps cutting the rubber elbow like the TRD can do.

lol u ces fan boys crack me up...... thegourou20 if your in sydney try plazmaman cai its a good kit

Sorry mate just supplying the info as thegoru asked the question of what's difference if any and I answered it. simple.

If you cannot handle that then I'd suggest you hit the search button and start reading so you can answer the next question. more than happy for you to have your 5 minutes of fame......

Neil the valve clearance closing up was something I also thought about as well. Toyota don't do them in a service till about 40k service then 80k?? Someone clarify that one? (Spillage here's your chance...)

[thegourou20]

Unfortunately I am not in Sydney Spilige...and for some reason the plazmaman CAI does not inspire confidence in me :-/

I try to did reset the ECU and change the oil this weekend and i dont think anything happened. The temperature dropped as well quite significantly today and i definitely felt the car going harder in terms of lift but i am still not convinced...

Next i will get the water pump sorted so that i know everything is 100% with the car.

However, a few of you have started to get me thinking about the "lift bolts" which i have no idea and no clue where they are located. The stivo i have is a 2005 model and the lift bolts are supposed to be stronger than previous ones is that right?

But definitely Neil, the third option is not a concern since i always let the engine warm up to its usual level before hitting lift. You also referred to the tappet clearance...what exactly are you referring to?

N.B: I like when everyone who can help share their opinion and experiences. I also appreciate the time and effort you took in answering my questions. I am here to learn...not to copy (at least i try anyways) :)

[SILVABULLIT]

valve stem to valve adjuster clearance.

[the_random_hero]

valve stem to valve adjuster clearance.

They don't run hydraulic lifters?

[Guni]

The faulty LIFT bolts problems only exists in earlier models of the 2zz-ge. All it does is prevents LIFT from engaging. Sounds like u felt LIFT but just not as hard so I doubt this is the problem. This issue was since fixed in later models of the engine and ours being the 3rd revison/generation or therabouts so I won't even factor this into it.

I did at one point felt the same as you did and just changed my oil. That seems to have fixed it for me but looking that you already have, might be better to just get one of us to give you a 2nd or 3rd opinion

[spillige]

Sorry mate just supplying the info as thegoru asked the question of what's difference if any and I answered it. simple.

is it me or do your answers always sound biest towards this workshops products?

Unfortunately I am not in Sydney Spilige...and for some reason the plazmaman CAI does not inspire confidence in me :-/

it doesnt inspire confidence in u? they have only contributed to some of the fastest race cars in the country

[Evo7]

is it me or do your answers always sound biest towards this workshops products?

Let's not get into which is best again... it is always happening on here

thegourou,

i would most likely say that the extreme humidity down your way has been slightly altering the way LIFT kicks in, i have noticed this also, when its hot the car does not seem to go as quick, but when its cooler in the evening, there is slight difference, and you can get more satisfaction out of it.

aka 'mini-lift' lol

also, if your car is full of stuff, clothes etc. unload it and it will be even quicker lol :P

Evo