Engine oils, thoughts from experience

[Novicebutnice]

Good afternoon everyone,

My reason for this post is to get people's thoughts about what engine oils that they currently use.

When I purchased my 2017 RZ Camry I decided to supply my own engine oil, even though as part of the sale I got 3-4 years capped price servicing at $140

I decided to supply my own engine oil after discovering that the local dealership uses a semi-synthetic oil,

but with the oil change interval at 15,000km / 9 months I felt that the semi-synthetic wasn't up to the task (as I had seen that the engine oil level had dropped, which to me indicated that the oil was breaking down)

I currently use Shell Ultra 5W30 and have not noticed any loss of oil (I decided on this oil based on using Shell Ultra 5W40 in my last car) 


But I was wondering if people have any current experience with other oils (I'm happy with what I use, but I'm curious about Nulon and others).

In my last car I tried different brands, I found that when using Nulon (semi-synthetic 10W30) that my fuel consumption went up (compared to other semi-synthetic 10W30 oils) and found other users found the same thing (reading reviews and forums)

But this is old information, and what was true "years ago" may no longer be true.

I'm looking at full Synthetic 5W30, and I was wondering if anybody else has tried different brands and found any noticeable difference?



 

[campbeam]

I am currently using Shell Ultra 5W40. What I have noticed is that after less than 800km the oil has changed to a medium honey colour. I am putting this down to better additives for cleaning/removing oil sludge.

Over the past 3 years I have been mainly using 10W40 SN semi-synthetic oils usually Penrite or Nulon.This is because I bought them on special. Now I have mainly full synthetic 5w30 or 5W40 on hand. Brands include Castrol, Shell Ultra, Penrite and Nulon.

[Novicebutnice]

21 hours ago, campbeam said:

I am currently using Shell Ultra 5W40. What I have noticed is that after less than 800km the oil has changed to a medium honey colour. I am putting this down to better additives for cleaning/removing oil sludge.

Over the past 3 years I have been mainly using 10W40 SN semi-synthetic oils usually Penrite or Nulon.This is because I bought them on special. Now I have mainly full synthetic 5w30 or 5W40 on hand. Brands include Castrol, Shell Ultra, Penrite and Nulon.

I used Shell Ultra 5W40 in my last car (2005 Corolla sedan), and I did notice that as well,

but after that initial change the rate of oil discoloration slowed, and the engine was literally clean as new when I checked (taking off the oil cap, and using a torch to see as much as I could), to the point that when I changed and added in the oil it looked brand new as far as I could see in with the torch, absolutely no sludge what-so-ever, and no discoloration of engine components etc :-)


Do you find any noticeable difference, like the Engine being quieter using oil "X", or noticeable variation in fuel usage using oil "Y"?

I've been pretty happy with the Shell Ultra 5W30, but I was catching up with an old work mate at a wedding last year, and he was saying that Nulon is spending a lot on R&D over the last few years (apparently)

I haven't tried Penrite yet....

Edited July 28, 2020 by Novicebutnice

[campbeam]

2 minutes ago, Novicebutnice said:

Do you find any noticeable difference, like the Engine quieter using oil "X", or noticeable variation in fuel usage using oil "Y"?

I cannot say that I have noticed any significant differences. However I have been gradually progressing from mineral oils to semi-synthetic and finally to full synthetic.

I have also been using a variety of oil viscosities ranging from 15W-40. 10W-40, 10W-30, 5W-40 to 5W-30.

Because I do a lot of short distance driving, I choose to do a shorter oil change interval to keep oil sludge at bay.

It will be quite a while before I need to buy engine oil but I will be mainly interested in only considering a full synthetic oil say 5W-30 or 5W-40 on special.

[KAA]

I don;t know if it is imagination but I always feel the engine is much quieter when an oil change service is done..not that the noise has ever been bad but could be I know it is fresh.. I have mostly been using full syn for about 5 years now..10w 30..or recently 5w 30..never really noticed any fuel improvement but on checking the mode button today i am at 12L per 100 so happy with that..however not a huge amount of distance driving last few months..last 4 oil changes have been using Nulon full syn 5w 30..and yes read the same thing about a lot of R&D by them

Keep Safe

KAA

[Tony Prodigy]

Some of you may know that I've been using the Nulon 5w-30 since my original purchase when the car had 40k on the ODO and it's up to 120k now. I've been very happy with the Nulon product and have zero sludging. I do my oil servicing close to 10k each time and everything seems fine. I have been purchasing my oil when they go on special and usually stock up and have some Nulon left which I will obviously use then going to switch over to Penrite for the zinc content. I'm no oil expert but from what others have been saying, the zinc content is a good thing to have so I'll go with that if it means a little bit more protection. 

I'm planning to keep my Aurion long term so I want to take good care of it as much as possible.

If I get a chance this weekend I might do my 120k oil service and inspect the PCV ( as promised Nathan) 😁

[campbeam]

I am always looking at YouTube videos about synthetic oil. I am more interested in the real world experience and testing rather than the marketing hype designed to part you from your $$$.

Just came across this video and the engine valve train looks like new.

A good testament to using a synthetic oil and regular oil changes. Something else that I do is to read the comments.

I am thinking that the only way to justify buying the more expensive top of the range specialist full synthetic oils is with an extended oil change interval plus having a quality oil filter to support the longer oil change interval.

Personally, I now buy full synthetic oil when on special and select the lower oil viscosity suitable for my engine and driving conditions. I am also using non-genuine oil filters with a very short oil change interval that supports my usual short distance driving i.e. less than 20 minutes. This means that my engine is just getting up to operating temperature by the end of my commuter trip. Codename for my engine is "Sludgy" so my criteria is all about sludge protection and engine cleaning properties of the oil. I have mentioned in other threads that last 2 oil changes have been with Shell Ultra 5W-40 full synthetic. I am very impressed with its cleaning properties. However, next oil change will be with Nulon 5W-30 full synthetic mainly because different brands of oils have a different additive package.

[ZZT86]

That is a rippa clip, more than 200K kms & the cam caps look like new, the rockers same.  A very clean, as new motor. 👍

[TommyM]

Coming from personal experience myself & from knowledge within the automotive sector. I can't recommend Mobil 1 0w40 enough, but that's what i run my car on, the additives in Mobil 1 0w40 especially the base oils is what i look for the most. But personally if you want a great all round with proven use.

Penrite's HPR range is by far the top pick, even though base oils are more a group III, now they have a Premium non friction modified 0w40 from Penrite which is group IV & V base oils. Same with Nulon's 0w40 being a group IV & V base oils. Always consult your owners manual for a general idea of specs you can use.

E.g 5w30, 15w40, 20w50, 10w30

With that information you can tailor it to 2020 levels if it's an older vehicle (e.g 5w40, 5w50, 10w40, etc).

 

But personally after being 3600km into my service interval running Mobil 1 0w40, hasn't burnt a drop, instant oil pressure on cold start too. Now yes i'm aware it can be pricey, some is marketing but also i've seen many many cars running Mobil 1 with well over 500k with spotless insides, super smooth operation, etc.

 

Top picks from me & multiple other people i know.

1. Mobil 1 

2. Penrite 

 

Though if it's Royal Purple, etc - them oil brands just embarrass themselves, they're not worth the price tag. 

[ZZT86]

BITOG has often commented on how good Mobile1 is especially in the USA where they supposedly also make Toyota's own TGMO 0W20 for 86 & BRZ which is extremely well regarded.

Only problem with group 4 & 5 oils is their price otherwise they're the best all day long.

[Tony Prodigy]

I'd use Mobil 1 too if they put it on special occasionally. Mongrels never do so Nulon or Penrite it is.

[KAA]

Totally agree..IF Mobil 1 is ever on special I would do a "Tony" as i call it and HOARD it like Gold LOL...but I have not seen it on special for years so I continue with Nulon as I have found it a very very good product

Keep Safe

[Tony Prodigy]

29 minutes ago, KAA said:

Totally agree..IF Mobil 1 is ever on special I would do a "Tony" as i call it and HOARD it like Gold LOL...but I have not seen it on special for years so I continue with Nulon as I have found it a very very good product

Haha yeah mate. The silly buggers must love losing market share to Nulon and Penrite. I'd rather give my money to Australian companies anyway. These two mentioned products are superior.

[TommyM]

5 hours ago, ZZT86 said:

BITOG has often commented on how good Mobile1 is especially in the USA where they supposedly also make Toyota's own TGMO 0W20 for 86 & BRZ which is extremely well regarded.

Only problem with group 4 & 5 oils is their price otherwise they're the best all day long.

Yeah Group 4 & 5's are pricey, but it's still cheap insurance over a new engine. The 5w30 is alot cheaper than the 0w40 that's for sure. Mobil & Penrite for me is all i'd stick with. But i swear by Penrite synthetic ATF which is what i run over the Toyota stuff which is good but i prefer the extra heat protection of synthetic ATF

Higher temp range, better additives, etc - since changing my auto to it, shifts brilliantly, definitely feels more eager to kickdown basically instantly if i need to. 100% smoother too, no shudder.

 

I've seen much good results with Mobil 1 0w40 hence why i use it. Reason why i don't use the Penrite 0w40 is it isn't friction modified 😁

Otherwise i would. 

 

Either way Mobil, Penrite & some Nulon's you can't go wrong with.

[campbeam]

For the past 5 years, I have been on average replacing the oil every 3 months to progressively desludge the engine. Finally getting to the stage of considering extending the oil change interval to say 5000km/ 6 months or when the oil gets dark enough in colour, but not black.

Following YouTube video details the advice from a USA Toyota Master Technician.

 

[KAA]

Thanks Ash ..super interesting video made a lot of great points I took a lot of notes for future endeavours on my own beast

KAA

[Tony Prodigy]

I like his videos. He made an excellent point about changing your oil on time and to ignore Toyota's frequency of 10,000 mile  interval. He went on to say that it may be ok for the first 3 years or so, but after the engine has reached 100,000 miles, and your extended warranty runs out, that's when you start having issues.

It's like Toyota lead you down a garden path in the beginning, everything is nice and rosey, then the garden path your on leads to a sheer cliff and they throw you off lol..

I didn't know Toyota oil is made by Mobil 1. I wonder if that's the same for all countries and not just in the U.S.

 

 

[Squalled]

Since owning my 2005 Corolla Sportivo, I've done 95% of my oil changes and the rest have been done by my local mechanic if my car has gone in for another fix of sort and I usually provide my own oil of my choice which they thankfully don't mind.

I've owned my car over 5 years and have clocked over 100000kms since I've owned it and have used 3 main oils in my car.

- Penrite 10 Tenths Racing 10W-40
- Penrite Full Synthetic 10W-40
- Nulon Full Synthetic 5W-30

For the first 2 years or so I mostly used the Penrite variants would use the 10 Tenths if I could get my hands on it if not, I'd use the other Penrite Full Synthetic. Between those 2 oils I didn't notice any significant difference in oil consumption, discolouration etc. At the time the most common issue was the fact I had quite a few old seals which have since been replaced.

One of the more common things with 2ZZ-GE's which I have personally found is that when you run 10W-40 or a higher viscosity oil, it tends to make the engine quite "tappety"  which is especially noticed when idling. I heard this for some time and assumed it is quite normal which it is but a few friends had recommended trying Nulon 5W-30 Full Synthetic as they had rated it quite highly and noted minimal burning and discolouration.

I bit the bullet and went ahead with Nulon 5W-30. The first thing I did notice was the "tappety" noise wasn't louder, more or less the same or a slightly lower in volume. After doing a few thousand kms (I usually do oil changes between 5000-7500) I went to change the oil and it looked no worse than using any of the Penrite 10W-40 variants and I found I usually have the same amount of oil coming out as well which is a good sign that I'm not burning this oil. My servicing is complemented with genuine Toyota oil filters and I do have a few sets of sump plug gaskets I change every 2nd oil change or so to keep it freshly sealed.

I do rate Penrite pretty well but I'm also super impressed with Nulon and have 0 issues with both since using them. For 2ZZ-GE's I usually recommend Nulon 5W-30 Full Synthetic unless the owner has mentioned it burns a bit of oil which in that case I'd usually recommend trying a 10W-30 or 10W-40 and seeing how that goes. Unlike Honda's various VTEC engines from the 90s and early 2000s, the 2ZZ-GE is generally not known to burn a large amount of oil between changes so if this becomes the case it's usually something more sinister causing the oil consumption (I could be wrong but this is what I've found over the years).

Edited November 19, 2020 by Squalled

[TommyM]

8 hours ago, Squalled said:

Since owning my 2005 Corolla Sportivo, I've done 95% of my oil changes and the rest have been done by my local mechanic if my car has gone in for another fix of sort and I usually provide my own oil of my choice which they thankfully don't mind.

I've owned my car over 5 years and have clocked over 100000kms since I've owned it and have used 3 main oils in my car.

- Penrite 10 Tenths Racing 10W-40
- Penrite Full Synthetic 10W-40
- Nulon Full Synthetic 5W-30

For the first 2 years or so I mostly used the Penrite variants would use the 10 Tenths if I could get my hands on it if not, I'd use the other Penrite Full Synthetic. Between those 2 oils I didn't notice any significant difference in oil consumption, discolouration etc. At the time the most common issue was the fact I had quite a few old seals which have since been replaced.

One of the more common things with 2ZZ-GE's which I have personally found is that when you run 10W-40 or a higher viscosity oil, it tends to make the engine quite "tappety"  which is especially noticed when idling. I heard this for some time and assumed it is quite normal which it is but a few friends had recommended trying Nulon 5W-30 Full Synthetic as they had rated it quite highly and noted minimal burning and discolouration.

I bit the bullet and went ahead with Nulon 5W-30. The first thing I did notice was the "tappety" noise wasn't louder, more or less the same or a slightly lower in volume. After doing a few thousand kms (I usually do oil changes between 5000-7500) I went to change the oil and it looked no worse than using any of the Penrite 10W-40 variants and I found I usually have the same amount of oil coming out as well which is a good sign that I'm not burning this oil. My servicing is complements with genuine Toyota oil filets and I do have a few sets of sump plug gaskets I change every 2nd oil change or so to keep it freshly sealed.

I do rate Penrite pretty well but I'm also super impressed with Nulon and have 0 issues with both since using them. For 2ZZ-GE's I usually recommend Nulon 5W-30 Full Synthetic unless the owner has mentioned it burns a bit of oil which in that case I'd usually recommend trying a 10W-30 or 10W-40 and seeing how that goes. Unlike Honda's various VTEC engines from the 90s and early 2000s, the 2ZZ-GE is generally not known to burn a large amount of oil between changes so if this becomes the case it's usually something more sinister causing the oil consumption (I could be wrong but this is what I've found over the years).

Well i've mainly done highway/freeway k's on my Avalon, basically half way through my 7.5k - 8k interval, engine internals aren't dirty due to it having frequent oil & filter changes so running higher base stock oils i'm alot more comfortable running 8k max. 😁

I only use OEM filters because that's what i choose to use, aftermarket air filters might be different in terms of fitment, not as many pleats, etc.

I think the main problem child was when Toyota introduced the 2.4L in the Camry which was notorious for excessive oil consumption. Bulletin/recall was issued too. Yeah every Toyota is different, running 0w40 in mine, whisper quiet. Only thing i hear is belts turning & injectors pulsing.

12 hours ago, Tony Prodigy said:

I didn't know Toyota oil is made by Mobil 1. I wonder if that's the same for all countries and not just in the U.S.

 

 

Neither did i actually, maybe it's the US, who knows.... i know the two dealerships my car was at still run Mobil oils, so they can't be to bad. As my mechanic says "if it's happy on X brand of oil, don't change it. I was gonna switch to Penrite possibly but meh, it's had Mobil all it's life. 240k later, still mechanically strong & pulls hard. 

[campbeam]

On 8/30/2020 at 5:01 PM, campbeam said:

Codename for my engine is "Sludgy" so my criteria is all about sludge protection and engine cleaning properties of the oil. I have mentioned in other threads that last 2 oil changes have been with Shell Ultra 5W-40 full synthetic. I am very impressed with its cleaning properties. However, next oil change will be with Nulon 5W-30 full synthetic mainly because different brands of oils have a different additive package.

Road trip and Shell Ultra 5W-40 have done another great clean of the engine. Surprised at how much sludge particles were in the filter cartridge and came out during the oil change.

Even more impressed with its cleaning properties so on the top of my hit list to buy more when it comes on special. 

[campbeam]

On 11/18/2020 at 3:21 PM, TommyM said:

I think the main problem child was when Toyota introduced the 2.4L in the Camry which was notorious for excessive oil consumption. Bulletin/recall was issued too. Yeah every Toyota is different, running 0w40 in mine, whisper quiet.

I was under the impression that Toyota had redesigned the piston and the oil ring to address the excessive oil consumption issue. The following YouTube video indicates otherwise and that the underlying cause is poor quality oils with not enough detergent additive.

 

 

 

[Tony Prodigy]

Sorry guys. I couldn't help myself. This 👇👇👇 performance part may need modification to fit. 

Yep, it'll need  a Johnson Rod, of course 🤣🤣😜

 

 

Edited January 20, 2021 by Tony Prodigy

[Tony Prodigy]

On a more serious note, THIS video explains the oil consumption issue that Toyota's can face. He makes total sense too.

[campbeam]

1 hour ago, Tony Prodigy said:

On a more serious note, THIS video explains the oil consumption issue that Toyota's can face. He makes total sense too.

Absolutely pay attention to what The Care Care Nut says in his YouTube videos. Easy for me to agree with what he said about buying oil in the last minute of the video because that is exactly what I have been doing.

Progressed to only buying the full synthetic engine oils when they are on special. My preference has been upon oils with high detergent additive levels. 

[ZZT86]

I love this guy, he talks so much sense all coming from experience.