Sportivo or SP23

[Chompies]

hey guys, im new here... but i thought i'd just like to get some of your opinions

im about to get a new car, and im tossing up between a Corolla Sportivo or a Mazda 3 SP23.

the sportivo is about $5k under the SP23, but the SP23 has more saftey features such as 6 airbags and triple H construction.. and more torque.. for these reasons im leaning towards the SP23.

however, if any of you can convince me, i'll certainly consider buying a sportivo

:) Thanks a lot!

[CAP]

Ilivfor6 has both, if you search previous posts you'll see his opinion on how they compare, but in a nutshell, the Sportivo is a much more enjoyable drive.

[Tivo Matt]

hey guys, im new here... but i thought i'd just like to get some of your opinions

im about to get a new car, and im tossing up between a Corolla Sportivo or a Mazda 3 SP23.

the sportivo is about $5k under the SP23, but the SP23 has more saftey features such as 6 airbags and triple H construction.. and more torque.. for these reasons im leaning towards the SP23.

however, if any of you can convince me, i'll certainly consider buying a sportivo

:) Thanks a lot!

←

Depends what you are after really?

You are probably only going to get biased replies here though :P lol.

The Sportivo gives you that bit more excitement factor IMO! I also didn't really like the look of the SP23 ( though everyone else does so maybe its me?). The SP23 has more features in terms of safety and design... but if you are the type of person who like to modify the interior... new stereo etc.. i suggest you head over to the sydney mazda club? i think thats what they are called. or something like that. Someone may have the link! Mazda seem to like to build the stereo into the dash these days making it near impossible to customise etc.

ummm yeah... describe what you are after in a car and what you like to do to it (if anything) and you'll find some of us will try to be as unbiased as we can!

Like i said... Sportivo has that extra excitement factor.. but ATM it also has the extra headache factor... but the new one, i would suggest... won't have as many niggling issues :)

[peekay]

Carlo he hasn't got the sp23 yet he will have it at the end of the month... :D

[Chompies]

thanks for your responses..

im after good performance and good fuel economy, as well as comfort and safety

the most underlying factor however, is reliability.... i want to get a car that i can keep for at least 6 years or so. are any of you owners having problems with the car?.. im planning on getting the pre-facelift model, which means its the 'old' one that u guys have

also, is the sportivo easy to mod?

Edited October 12, 2004 by Chompies

[Tivo Matt]

thanks for your responses..

im after good performance and good fuel economy, as well as comfort and safety

the most underlying factor however, is reliability.... i want to get a car that i can keep for at least 6 years or so.  are any of you owners having problems with the car?.. im planning on getting the pre-facelift model, which means its the 'old' one that u guys have

also, is the sportivo easy to mod?

←

Peekay is your modding man! LOL! I'm sure he will reply RE that.

In terms of stereo etc if thats what you are referring to... YES much easier than the SP23!

Performance and Fuel Economy are excellent from my point of view in the sportivo! I usually get well over 600km from a tank and others have reported heaps more.... and thats with a good mixture of hard driving and casual driving.

Reliability... well... depends! LOL. Its reliable in the sense that i haven't know of one to just 'break down'. But... there ARE niggling issues with the older model atm which are still being sorted (browse the forums and you will find them). So if you are prepared to see that through then YES... its pretty reliable. I think Peekay has close, if not the oldest sportivo here so he can probably also comment in this regards also.

Put it this way:

I'm 22 and i got this car for a few reasons:

* It has a fair bit of get up and go for a little car and its exciting to drive

* a family member works for toyota so i get a 21.5% discount...

* I wanted to buy a car and keep it for a long time... no matter what happens. Even though i earn a decent amount for a young bloke... buying a house these days in Sydney is near impossible... and i HATE the thought of renting for the rest of my life... so i wanted to get a reasonably cheap car that has good performance, Pay it off quickly... and start saving for that house! LOL! ATM my Girlfriend is still at UNI and only working part time... so it'll be a while before she can contribute financially towards that goal... so yeah.

Hahah not that you needed to know all that last info... but i guess my point is that i see it as a reliable car!

Either way, you can't go wrong with either car IMO. It all comes down to... Money IMO and whether you want to spend the extra on the Mazda for those safety extras!

[SILVABULLIT]

hey guys, im new here... but i thought i'd just like to get some of your opinions

im about to get a new car, and im tossing up between a Corolla Sportivo or a Mazda 3 SP23.

the sportivo is about $5k under the SP23, but the SP23 has more saftey features such as 6 airbags and triple H construction.. and more torque.. for these reasons im leaning towards the SP23.

however, if any of you can convince me, i'll certainly consider buying a sportivo

:) Thanks a lot!

←

Hey Chompies

The sp23 does have more torque and extra airbags etc but where is runs out of power the Sportivo is alive and kicking. Gearbox in sp23 is very family car orientated and as far as handling is concerned you can feel that it's a heavier car than the sportivo. I was impressed with the dash layout and interior design and does come with a few more extras than the Sportivo but the Sportivo definately has the more sporty feel and excitement factor about it. If you want to talk further then PM me.

Cheers SILVABULLIT :D

[Chompies]

thanks for your posts guys, you have been a lot more helpful than the guys in one of the mazda3 forums.

i like the stivo's (im picking up the lingo) 141Kw, but i fear that it requires too much of a rev to reach. so when driving around the city, for example, im thinking the mz3 will be more practical.

i agree with your comment on the weight silva. the sp23, however, has 17" rims, which i hear, makes it handle very well.

maaan...... i want both cars <_<

[unfamilia]

i went through the same dilema... went for the stivo as i could sit comfortabley in the car without my left leg jammed up against the console... also the gear sift was terrible and the clutch more life less than the stiv.. poor feel on pick u.

also tyres ar $320 each to replace on the 17's...... and the handeling is better around town but poor when going for it compared to the stivo. However... the sp23 seats are more comfortable and the rear end is less twitchy with independaent rear suspension.

For the monu and not having a 2 month wait... the stivo wins... every woman and her south east suburbs wife/dog is getting in on the sp23... the stivo, a rare and exclusive sleeper. The stivo will have better resale and street cred in 5-8yrs when they become another street cult car for young p plate drivers.

[Sport1vo]

Welcome Chompies

I went via the dilema, now I am onto my second "non-facelift" Sportivo.

Most problems with a new model on the market have been sorted out.

In the long run, a Toyota is a Toyota, a Mazda is a Mazda.

Check out NRMA and RACV etc for safety crashworthyness. Just because the Mazda had more airbags doesn't mean it safer.

Most owners on the forum purchase there cars well below list price on the road, so money saved buying the Stivo would be far greater.

The Mazda is a nice car, but why have a space saver instead of a real spare wheel as per Sportivo?

Alternative vehicles that I had to choose form was a VW Golf, Peugeot 307, Astra Turbo, Focus ST170, Clio Sport, Sp23 and the Stivo.

Best car, bang for you buck and all-rounder, the Sportivo. Come to our meets and check out the vehicles.

Edited October 12, 2004 by sport1vo

[eddy_torrezz]

gday i test drove both cars when i recently got my stivo.

must admit the sp23 is a good but but

the clutch is ****house the wait on one is even worse.

bigger motor less power 115kw handles ok uses more fuel.

but it has abit more room than the stivo.

the stivo is 141kw 6 speed less room but handles well is heaps more responsive.

smaller motor but more power.less on fuel even the fact its premium.

but at the end of the day each to there own.

best way to go is test drive both on same day and see what ya think.

i also drove honda civic/jazz

subaru impreza rs

suzuki ingis sport

mazda sp23/neo genki

ford focus

holden astra/barina

mitsubishi lancer vrx

toyota corolla sportivo

and all know what i went with personaly you cant bypass the sportivo.

best bang for buck

and is deffinatly a sleeper.

[unfamilia]

I also considered the pug 307, golf, mazda 6 and even a ba ford xr6... stivo won

een in crash safety... you might hit your drivers head if the window is open in an ofset crash on the frame, but the same test in a mazda 3 results in fatal chest injuries for driver...

id rather have a bump on the head than chest injuries

[eddy_torrezz]

by the way if there the only 2 cars ya looking at id say test the subaru impreza rs.

that and the stivo were what i got down to the stivo has more power and economy.

but the impreza has race seats all wheel drive.

same price bracket.

loose the idea of the sp23.

good luck m8

[Chompies]

thanks a heap guys... this afternoon i was loving the sp23...

but now, i think you've opened up my eyes :)

i've taken both cars on test drives before, my only gripe with the sportivo is the 6 speed box, which was a bit hard to shift into gears... i guess im not used to it

i really like the idea of the sportivo being a sleeper... i agree that not that many people are actually aware of its existence, and i certainly dont want to get a car that everyone has.. hell.. i was gonna buy the bright yellow sp23, because i heard they were rare

eddy, i didnt get a chance to look at the impreza, probably because im vein and prefer the looks of the sportivo and sp23

[SILVABULLIT]

Another notable comment is the possible cost of repairs. If you have a prang and say half the airbags go off, there's a nice repair bill. If you didn't know the engine in the SP23 is the engine out of the Mazda 6! Goes better in a lighter car that handles and stops better but the engine is very harsh and prone to transfering vibrations through the controls(steering,gear shift, pedals etc) throughout the rev range. Makes the Stivo feel quite smooth and as far as gear changes are concerned it's almost possible to get the tyres chirping when shifting into 3rd with the Mazda's truck weighted flywheel! Changing quickly results in the usual thump and *****. I'm sounding a bit biased but I looked at a lot of cars before buying and the Stivo wins hands down for value for the hard earned dollar.

Besides the Stivo has the somewhat "sleeper " tag attached to as every V8 driving bevan thinks it's a base model with the old bodykit and fancy wheels. Ask JC - he's a V8 ute man who's seen the light! He just wishes that the bloke in the new Rolla didn't rear end him to prove a point!

Cheers SILVABULLIT :D

[imek]

Top Gear: Mazda 3 is cheap, cheaply build and the only fun in it are red lights on the stero unit. Its another "supermarket" product. Better go for Golf V if you want THIS kind of a car.

Me:

If you want fun, go for stivo, and save 5k for loooots of mods.

[Chompies]

alrightey

in terms of handling and agility.. how does the sportivo rate? ..

the mazda 3 is quick and responsive, with a electrohydraulic steering system

[xoom]

Hi Chompies,

Welcome to the forum.

Here is a phrase which was used when someone asked the same question u r asking now but with regards to the ford focus.

U cant out handle me if u cant catch me  :P  :P  ;)  ;)

But seriously i think the s'tivo is just the best bang 4 ur buck and yes there are things that were done to achieve this eg torsion beam instead of independant rear suspension :(, no LSD :( etc etc etc but at the end of the day a car is a total package not just its engine or steering system or mag's etc and in this line of thinking i dont think you can go past the s'tivo in terms of the package it is offering. especially for the price

cheer

Bill

[Chompies]

haha xoom.. the sportivo is faster, i get it!!!

im just wondering how it handles, is there much body roll? understeer?

[CAP]

Carlo he hasn't got the sp23 yet he will have it at the end of the month... :D

←

But Paul, he's driven them back to back. :P

[Ilivfor6]

Yeah I pick up an SP23 for the wife at the end of the month.

Why an SP23 for the 2nd car... well we need a family car as we plan to start one within a couple years. That in itself should give you an indication of how I see the SP23.

My wife really wanted another Sportivo because she loves to drive mine but we really need the 2nd car to have a large boot not a hatch, and thus prefered the mazda 3 sedan shape over the corolla sedan.

The Mazda is more of a cruiser, drive it along and enjoy the scenery it certainly is not the car you take out and punt hard as you really feel the weight. As far as torque goes my stivo pretty much pulls harder in any gear and almost any rev, but it is modded some. The mazda's engine did not feel as strong down low as I thought it was going to and then would run out of breath toward the red line, but they have lowered the compression with different pistons and used a less aggressive ECU map compared to the mazda 6. All in the attempt to stop the SP23 outperforming the Mazda 6. And I agree with the others the clutch in the mazda is awfull, it just feels lifeless and the gerabox is certainly not designed for pushing the car hard.

Yesterday in the Sportivo, as I have already told Peekay & Danthuyer I had a run against an Audi S3 and up to the end of 3rd gear ended up losing by 1/2 my bonnet, very much to the Audi drivers surprise. If you wish to enjoy spirited driving look again at the Sportivo but if you do just want to cruise along comfortably go the way of the mazda for this it's a fantastic car.

Now as for suspension mods:

If you want to improve handling do the springs (get either Eibach or King Springs as these are already proven by many members here). rear swaybar and front strut brace. This will cost under a grand if you negotiate on price and will put the sportivo into a totally different handling league. It becomes very agile and a lot of fun to drive.

Or if you would like to spend more you can go a full custom koni setup with damper adjustible Shocks and matched springs with the rear sway bar and front strut brace for under $2000 fitted.

This setup gives superb handling and feel, allows you to feel everything the car is doing on the road but still remains comfortable for day to day driving. I have this setup and the car just has this total sensation of being stuck down on the road. A number of company's offer this sort of setup so you can get it from most decent tyre & suspension places.

Performance mods:

To really get the car moving and add good doses of torque down low add a CAI (cold air induction) and the CES cat back exhaust. Not only will this combination give you more low down torque but your above 6000rpm acceleration is kicked into a whole new gear. This setup will cost between $1200 & $1500 depending on the CAI you go with and give you a flywheel figure of around 152-155kw. I went with the TRD CAI which cost $470 because on the dyno it was proven to give the best all rev performance down low & up High. You can chose to have a custom one made but I chose one that already had proven dyno output where I new what I was getting.

If you wish to spend more you can then add extractors to the above for anywhere between $800-$1500. A good set of extractors will again increase your torque and power. Again I went with TRD as when I was purchasing there was not a lot to choose from and they gave a good gain of about 8kw and a very good dose of torque while still utilising the factory heat shield. Fitted the TRD Extractors cost about $1200.00. Pricey but the gains in performance certainly felt it especially betweem 3000-6000rpm

Next option is a lightweight flywheel and clutch. This changes the driving dynamic of the car completly. Driving the car you can feel the engine just wants to get up and go. The engine runs silky smooth (it really purs) the gear changes become smooth, direct and very fast and sound sensational and acceleration is much quicker. This is the best mod I have done to the car. I would strongly recommend the TOM's flywheel. A Stronder clutch & TOM's flywheel combo will set you back anywhere between $1000-$1500 depending on the clutch you choose and labour rate for the install.

A Unichip is also another good option for this car. Cost fitted & tuned is about $1200 and you will get an approx 10% gain across the board with the benefit of a lot more down low torque. Besides the Unichip there are also other similiar products but my best experiences have been with the Unichip but this is a very personal thing with each person... Or you could go the complete ECU replacement but at the moment there are only real 2 options which are Apexi Power FC or a Motec system. These both give complete control over the engine allowing you to set optimal timing for your VVT (this is the continous variable valve timing) and VVL (variable valve lift I think its called). The piggy backs such as Unichip cannot offer this. A good example is to raise the rev limit per gear and set the car to perform as lotus has and that is have the rev limit set to 8600 in 1st & 2nd, 8300 in 3rd & 4th and 8000 in 5th & 6th with the lift engagement at 6100rpm and lift disengagement at 5900rpm. The complete ECU swap though is expensive and can set you back anywhere from $3000 to $5000 including fitment & tuning.

There are also a variety of smaller little mods that can be done to the car that concentrate on optimising different systems on the car from cooling to elctrical which on their own show only slight gains but put together add up to noticeable improvements.

Sorry for the long reply but that's a general overview of what I have played with on this car as far as modding goes and once my CES exhaust arrives and the unichip is optimised for it I am expecting around 135kw at the wheels or probably around 175kw at the flywheel and all this for not a lot more than what the Mazda is costing me compared to what I bought my Sportivo for.

But again if you do not wish to mod or give the car a good hard drive every now and then get the Mazda as it is a comfortable reliable car with decent performance. But if you spend the difference between the mazda and the sportivo on mods for the sportivo you can end up with a real sleeper. Comfortable to drive day to day with ample low end torque for day to day city driving but the top end and handling to go out there and take on Audi S3's, Honda S2000's, Nissan 350Z's and even give WRX's a run for their money. All in a very reliable package. I really luv what my Sportivo has turned into and there really is not a car under $100,000 I would trade it for.

Mate if your in Melbourne PM me if you like and we can get together and you can have a try in my car to see if that is what you like... And I have no doubt a couple of other members with less modded Sportivo's would also come along for you to see theirs and that way allowing you to really make an informed decision. A car is a lot of money so it is alway best to drive & see as many as you can to make sure it is the right choice for you!

Either way you go both are good cars and you would more than likely be happy with either!

Cheers

[Northy]

alrightey

in terms of handling and agility.. how does the sportivo rate? ..

the mazda 3 is quick and responsive, with a electrohydraulic steering system

←

the money that you save will get you lowered springs, new shocks, Rims and new tyres and prolly a cold air intake too. put that against the SP23 and i know which one I would want to be driving.

[peekay]

Carlo he hasn't got the sp23 yet he will have it at the end of the month... :D

←

But Paul, he's driven them back to back. :P

←

Carlo ....Back to Back now thats and interesting position... :P I aways though he was a bit strange.... :o

[Ilivfor6]

Carlo he hasn't got the sp23 yet he will have it at the end of the month... :D

←

But Paul, he's driven them back to back. :P

←

I drove over to the Mazda dealer, went out in the SP23 without the salesman for about 35-40 minutes and then hopped back into my sportivo and drove home.

As soon as I climbed back into my car and hit the gas I remembered just how much more fun to drive mine was and it was certainly one heck of a lot more responsive and faster. The other thing you notice is just how much more solid the sportivo feels (ie: closing the door the sportivo has more of that solid feel where the Mazda feels and sound more tiney. Even my wife commented on that point of her own accord.

[mtbrider]

Looking at it financially you say the Mazda is $5K more.

So if you borrowed the lot

Sportivo $30,000 Mazda $35,000 @ 12.35% (standard unsecured personal loan) over 5 years

Sportivo $673 per month

Mazda $785 per month

Is the Mazda worth $112 per month more - no way

Save the $6720 over the 5 years and go O/S for a holiday